China had this DSL for building mobile apps for years. Those these apps are initially embedded inside WeChat/Alipay, there are now frameworks that allow it to run outside, like uniapp.
I've had very limited exposure to Alipay mini-programs (took a daytrip to Shenzhen from HK); but anything I had to touch (couples of restaurant menus; buying tickets for metro) was _screaming_ "this is poorly constructed webpage", not native-like experience.
Are there some you would recommend to see as an example of it being done right?
I mean those 1st party integrations directly listed in WeChat services page are probably good examples of services that "feel" nice to interact, because they are used by millions of people everyday and they are need to optimized and polished to be able to serve millions of users.
Here's a screenshot of the list, if you want to Google and check out some of them: https://imgur.com/a/KKEdliE
There's a pretty big difference in what UX "feels nice" to East Asian audiences vs Western audiences. This video provides some insight into why this might be:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSMFnJnY7EA
The comments make it seem like it's more a case of users tolerating it due to the apps usefulness. Interesting video though, haven't had any contact with Chinese apps, so that was enlightening.
I agree that numbers alone might not mean much, but I do think B2C apps with millions of users have a higher bar in terms of design and polish compared to B2B/ERP apps.
We're in a thread talking about a technology that purports to make creating "native mobile apps, as easy as creating a website"; and the parent claimed that the Alipay/WeChats mini-app stacks are similar.
I don't think asking for examples of this resulting in an experience that's pleasant is unreasonable?
I think the point OP is making is that the relative pleasantry of the experience isn't as important for end users as it is for us developers. My anecdotal experience bears that out: I shudder when I see a web-heavy native app, my non-tech friends don't bat an eyelid. People learn UIs, no matter how janky, very quickly if the end goal is important to them.
Well, do those WeChat services have competition? That's where I've seen the push for better UX: it's a signal to users that your product is overall higher quality. So not so much 'pretty power company technicians' and more 'Is the lobby of the hotel clean?'.
> poorly constructed webpage", not native-like experience
yes "poorly constructed" is the key here. Poorly constructed "native" apps are not better.
Let's not pretend that all apps need native capabilities. The vast majority of them, or the vast majority of their functionality, can boils down to showing lists and images. Pretty wasteful to make apps in native languages just to do that if you ask me.
Those mini apps are built on the same web stack. I believe the main advantages of creating mini apps are that the platform provides identity (allowing you to know who the users are upon permission approval) and payment APIs.
Aren't those just web apps running inside a webview widget? What's "native" about that? (but tbh, at first glance this Hyperview thing looks like it's just re-inventing web browsers too).
I think the key idea is not the renderer layer, but the concept of DSL so that it can run on multiple platforms natively.
To go back to your question. WeChat actually has two sets of renderers for mini programs, one based on webview, and one based on native iOS / Android components. But you are right that most mini programs are using mostly webview to render, with only a few things being natively rendered.
The "Western" (whatever that is) tech ecosystem has long had this technology out there .. its the "Western" marketing ecosystem that has been squashing it - for example, Apple quashing any and all use of JITs and VMs in order to keep their native platform relevant ..
Are there some you would recommend to see as an example of it being done right?