[CWuestefeld]

Your point is usually true, when the system is working as intended.

But it's not all that unusual for the gov't to really "have it in" for someone, but not be able to pin the crime on them, as with Al Capone.

In his case, the government didn't think it could pin the true charges on him, so he was actually convicted on tax charges. The tax code is big, obscure, and no expert agrees on the detailed interpretation, so it's not too hard to find some technicality that will convict anyone.

This encryption thing could easily be misused the same way: they can't prove you're a bad guy, so they trump up some technicality charges just to get you locked up.

[mjwalshe]

Uk Judges are separate from the govenment.

You would ahve to go back to the bad old days of the star chamber to find the UK law system doing anything as doddgy as Al Capone (not exactly the USAs Legal systems finest hour)

[Zak]

Uk Judges are separate from the govenment.

In the UK, the term "government" refers to the executive branch. Outside that use, it encompasses the legislative, executive and judiciary power of a state. Wikipedia gives the following definition:

Government consists of the legislators, administrators, and arbitrators in the administrative bureaucracy who control a state at a given time, and the system by which they are organized.

Judges are part of that by definition, even if there's some separation from the other components.

[mjwalshe]

No Judges are part of the "establishment" not the "govenment" ask Tony or Dave about the judges who ruled against them over a large number of issues.

I dubt wikipedia edited by a large number of Non UK People woud get the subtle destiction I am making here.

[kbolino]

The term "government" has multiple meanings, but the most direct and common meaning is for the entire apparatus of state power, literally "the instrument which governs". This is true in all places that speak English, the United Kingdom included.

In the United States, we use the term "administration" to refer to an executive, his cabinet, and other associated officials. However, we still recognize the (not-so-subtle) distinction between the administration and the government as a whole; our government, as yours, is divided into three separate branches, and then again into many departments, agencies, committees, circuits, districts, and other subdivisions thereof.

[mjwalshe]

Err the UK does not have a tripartate separation - there is a world out side of SV and the USA

[kbolino]

SV = El Salvador? South Vietnam?

I suppose you mean Silicon Valley, but I live on the East Coast (~3000 miles away). Also, our "tripartite separation" is based on yours, with the President taking the place of the Monarch/Prime Minister, the Congress taking the place of Parliament, and the Judiciary being roughly the same (we even use the same style of law, called common law, whereas most non-English-speaking countries use civil law).

[Zak]

The UK seems to have more crossover between legislative and executive functions, but the separation does exist, more or less. Parliament makes the laws. Various ministers execute the laws. The courts interpret the laws.

[CWuestefeld]

Here in the USA we like to periodically hold witch hunts. That's how we got Martha Stewart, for example.

[excuse-me]

Martha Stewart is a witch?

I suppose that explains the eye of newt in the recipes.

[mahyarm]

Judges, police and the people who direct the police are all socially close coworkers for the most part.

[batista]

>Uk Judges are separate from the govenment.

And how did that work out for the Guildford four for example?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guildford_Four_and_Maguire_Seve...

[barking]

See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Denning,_Baron_Denning#I...