[dsco]

It’s also a result of German unions. It’s practically impossible to fire people in the auto industry, so effectively what we do at VW is we have deadweight organisations where people end up if they are low performers and refuse to leave. The European auto industry is partly a charade to keep people employed.

[mmooss]

Where is there a higher quality of life and are there better cars than in Germany? Maybe Japan?

Germany is arguably the most successful economy in the world, with the most successful manufacturing. And it benefits others besides the shareholders and executives. Maybe others should be following their model.

[Cumpiler69]

>Germany is arguably the most successful economy in the world

Care to argument? The numbers disagree with you. Germany's share of global GDP decreased massively in the last 30 years loosing to US and China. That's the opposite of a successful economy.

>And it benefits others besides the shareholders and executives.

Who does it benefit? German workers have the lowest median wealth per capita in Western Europe being some of the poorest citizens of the richer developed countries, have some of the highest wealth inequality in EU, and saw the highest drop in purchasing power in the last ~2 years, while many German companies are making layoffs and relocating abroad.

>Maybe others should be following their model.

I don't think making yourself poorer while resting on a glorious industrial past, is a model people and countries want to follow. I'd say Poland's growth is a model to follow, not Germany's decline.

[Cumpiler69]

>It’s also a result of German unions.

I expect German politicians to defang the unions soon, similar to what they did with Agenda 2010 [1]. Yeah there will be some strikes and riots, but if the unions are causing an industry to be uncompetitive they're causing more harm than good.

It's a shame because while unions are good on paper, over time they seem to default to protecting themselves at the expense of the industry. Similar to communist parties.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agenda_2010

[mmooss]

> protecting themselves at the expense of the industry

Don't management and shareholders and finance do that? German car companies are among the most successful in the world - Germany and Japan sit at the pinnacle of car manufacturing.

[Cumpiler69]

>German car companies are among the most successful in the world

Nokia and Blackberry were also the most successful phone companies in the world till about 2007. Then they stopped.

Similarly, there's no guarantee German companies can keep their positions for long with increased competition from US and Chinese companies.

[ben_w]

There's never any guarantees, of course, but on the basis of current events, there's no reason to expect a big shift on attitudes towards unions.

Certainly the USA isn't going to be a relevant part of the discussion on this, as the only US brand I see enough to even notice here in Berlin is Tesla, and they have an actual factory just outside the city itself.

China is a much more likely threat, as they are increasingly "the factory of the world", and their internal cars prices are wildly lower than even the cheapest (new) cars here[0], and their high-end stuff is also really impressive.

(It may not surprise you to learn the EU has substantial tariffs on imported cars… but it was a big surprise to people in the UK who voted to leave the EU in the hope of boosting UK economic prospects).

Increasing automation is also a bigger threat to unions than US imports, as that allows new firms that may never hire union workers in the first place.

[0] https://electrek.co/2024/03/06/byd-launches-cheaper-seagull-...