[nuancebydefault]

I don't think he's plain wrong. Almost any non-living product is born out of software. If Japanese products are good, the software taking care of developing, manufacturing, marketing, selling, transporting, maintaining, rma'ing the product must be good.

[neuralRiot]

I might sound unbelievable for our fast-paced world of the west but there are centuries old shops in japan that still manufacture the same products with the same methods, not only in Japan but in various parts of the world, excellence wasn’t born after computers.

[lproven]

ISTM that both sides are right here, but both are deep in the woods and missing the trees.

"This product does not contain machines!" "No, but it is made using machines!"

(Remember the 6 classical machines: screw, inclined plane, wedge, lever, wheel and axle, and pulley.)

Perhaps, just maybe, the real problem here is that the basic machines the world has standardised on are junk, and you can't make junk into something good?

You can use junk to make good things, but you can't make good things out of junk.

Maybe the problem isn't Japan. Maybe the problem is that all modern software is junk, and even Japan can't make that good.

[neuralRiot]

>Perhaps, just maybe, the real problem here is that the basic machines the world has standardised on are junk

I believe most of the world has become complacent with “good enough” and a factory (be it hard or soft ware) that does not churn producs out of the door quickly enough is seen as “unproductive” Probably Japan software industry is trapped between being productive and excellent being neither after all.

[lproven]

Agreed.

[tivert]

> I don't think he's plain wrong. Almost any non-living product is born out of software. If Japanese products are good, the software taking care of developing, manufacturing, marketing, selling, transporting, maintaining, rma'ing the product must be good.

No. For a physical non-software-driven product, those things are pretty much orthogonal.

If a product is good, it's due to the attributes of the product itself, and those are mainly due to the design decisions and priorities of the manufacturer.

All the things you list may make the business more efficient and more successful, but they have little to do with the kinds of products I'm talking about.