[hackinthebochs]

30 Years is nothing on the timescales of geopolitics. How long has China been talking about unifying with Taiwan? Yet no one is under any illusion that China won't eventually make a move against Taiwan. The claim that Russia should consider NATO expansion irrelevant to its security is pure gaslighting.

[aguaviva]

The claim that Russia should consider NATO expansion irrelevant to its security is pure gaslighting.

And even more precisely: it's a claim that absolutely no one makes.

[hackinthebochs]

Funny, most of my discussions regarding Ukraine involve people making that very claim (or variations thereof)

[aguaviva]

Most likely what they were saying was actually quite different from that.

So you're gaslighting yourself, in effect.

[hackinthebochs]

Instead of linking you to some randoms comments, how about from the horses mouth:

https://www.reuters.com/article/world/albright-says-russia-h...

This is just one example of many if you Google. And don't bother trying to parse words to claim this isn't really an example of claiming NATO expansion is benign to Russia's security, it'll just confirm you are engaging in bad-faith.

[aguaviva]

Even if we accept your paraphrase, that's still quite different from saying "... is irrelevant to Russia's security."

Especially when we look at the broader context of what Albright was trying to say in that situation.

And don't bother trying ...

Keep it civil, please.

[hackinthebochs]

No, its not at all different. Like I said, bad faith.

Edit: Lol didn't recognize your username. If you didn't begin your engagements on such an adversarial footing, you might get more constructive replies.