[maxerickson]

If you want to say you are doing science, then yes, you need to define what you mean by "healthy" and make the case that the harm from vaccination was greater in your group than the harm from infection.

If you want to say your subjective group is self evidently better off with some option, then don't say you are making a scientific argument.

[gadders]

Unfortunately I don't have the budget to fund a large RCT. It is also worrying that the companies and health authorities with the budgets haven't done so either.

Unless there is some unknown, long term effect from COVID that is yet to manifest itself, it is self-evident that the comment that "It was also more dangerous to healthy young men than just getting COVID, due to myocarditis." is "Absolutely not true" is incorrect.

[llamaimperative]

You don't need an RCT. You need a study that compares COVID's many consequences and sequlae to the vaccine's myocarditis. Not COVID's myocarditis rate to the vaccine's myocarditis rate.

I can't find age-breakdown data of which specific complication causes the most death in COVID patients, but for the population broadly, it is multiple organ failure, then pneumonia and related pulmonary problems. Not myocarditis.

So if you're excluding the primary causes of death of COVID then sure, the tradeoff gets a lot less clear.

[gadders]

>> You don't need an RCT. You need a study that compares COVID's many consequences and sequlae

Effectively zero for healthy men under 40.

I do think common sense needs to play a part in your risk assessment.

[llamaimperative]

But the rate of myocarditis, even using the upper end numbers for the highest risk group, is also “effectively zero”! That pre-print shows myocarditis rate of 0.01% for men under 40.

The IFR for men between 35-39 is five and half times higher than that.

I wouldn’t mind common sense, but in lieu of that, some basic numeracy would be helpful.

[gadders]

>>The IFR for men between 35-39 is five and half times higher than that.

For healthy men?

[llamaimperative]

Not sure but CV risk is the primary comorbidity that matters for young people wrt COVID, which is also the main contributing factor to myocarditis risk. So no reason to believe there’s a huge difference here.