[izacus]

For posters like you I always wonder: why are you posting? Why did you even click on the article if you dislike Java so much?

Is this posturing? Do you feel cool? Why did you come here and bloviate over something as silly as a language choice?

[azinman2]

Are you the reason I got downvoted? I was very surprised by that.

I’ve spent years writing Java and later Scala, in academia and later production. I’ve always followed to see how the JVM and the language/ecosystem has progressed. And now I don’t use it at all. Is it really that odd to take a temperature on a site filled with other tech folks? I don’t understand why you took it so negatively and use words like bloviate, or attack me as just posturing to look cool (how does one look cool on a geeky Internet forum?). One of the HN tenants is to “converse curiously,” which is exactly my mindset when I wrote my comment. And if you look at the other replies, it seems others took it that way as well with healthy discussion.

[ivan_gammel]

Your comment is generic off-topic that has only Java in common with original post. The way it is written, it gives certain vibes and doesn’t sound like genuine invitation to compare Java with other technologies. If that was your intention, maybe you should write your own post and ask there instead.

[palata]

I don't understand the downvotes, I don't find your post offensive. My guess is that people don't downvote to moderate, but rather to show that they disagree. Which unfortunately kills the discussion a bit.

I like Java (but I love Kotlin), and it seems like work on the JVM is more active than ever. I can understand your preferences, but what I observe e.g. with Desktop apps is that people use Javascript and embed a whole browser with it (e.g. ElectronJS). I would always prefer a JVM desktop app. Also with modern UI frameworks (including e.g. Compose), I am really hoping that the JVM will get a boost for Desktop apps.

[izacus]

I absolutely downvoted to moderate - the post had nothing to do with the article on hand. It's much more appropriate for an Ask HN post.

It's really tiring to see these "Oh this language sucks" posts under articles that discuss details and techniques in languages - it added nothing useful to the conversation, especially since it was framed as a personal preference. Who cares that you don't care about Java?

[azinman2]

> Who cares that you don't care about Java?

It was framed as a personal factoid (used to use Java, now don’t), followed up by a question for everyone else: “Am I the only one?”And that’s why there’s healthy discussion to my comment if you look at the replies. I think it added quite a lot if you read it all. All of these quirks add up to a meta comment on the language.

[palata]

But it did not say "this language sucks". To me it was kind of asking something like "is Java still relevant nowadays?", in a polite way. It actually got a few interesting answers ("Java sucks" probably wouldn't).

I believe that it's enough to not upvote a message if you find it irrelevant. The upvoted messages will stay at the top. It is not completely off-topic: the people who will read the featured article have knowledge about Java, after all.

My concern is just that downvoting is fairly aggressive. You don't need to be massively downvoted many times to effectively end up being silenced (if you are moderated 2-3 times while you wrote a polite, genuine question, chances are that you won't come back). By aggressively downvoting everything that we don't find particularly relevant, I feel like it just encourages bubbles. "We are a group of Java enthusiast, just don't come talk to us if you are not a Java enthusiast yourself. Find a group of people who has the same preferences as you do instead".

[self_awareness]

I also don't understand the downvotes; the original post was polite and informative, the "moderator" throwing downvotes was aggressive, and more harm was done than help.

I have the upvote counters hidden, because I don't want to see some misguided individual to influence what should be important for me, and what shouldn't. I make my own filtering choices.

I wish that one day the internet will realize that upvote counters are more harmful than they are useful, just as it realized for downvotes. Upvotes in general promote bubbles.

[palata]

I would like to note the irony: my comment above is being downvoted as well :D. It is starting to feel like the kind of toxicity I find on StackOverflow.

[azinman2]

They seem to disagree :) Given I was polite, curious, and not leaving a “throwaway comment” that was on the broader topic (let alone the numerous substantive replies), it’s giving zealotry to me. Oh well.