[ryandrake]

Yes, yes, it’s “the product people.” Or “the managers.” Anyone but ourselves. If they would just stop changing requirements, we’d stop writing awful, buggy software. Not sure I really buy it. I’ve worked in software my whole life and I have never met any software engineering team who would magically have more discipline and rigor if only the managers went away. A team that cuts corners and shortchanges testing when the clock is ticking is likely also going to do that when the deadlines are more achievable. Attention to detail, measurement, thoroughness, an obsession with correctness… these are not environment specific things that come and go. They are traits of individual developers. You either have them or you don’t, and a screaming, impatient “product guy” can’t take these things out of you.

I'll admit that companies can set up processes that encourage (or discourage) rigor, and I firmly believe you can train the yolo out of software engineers. So it's not hopeless. It is very helpful to be in a company that values these things.