[throwaway48476]

Cars was always a low margin business, that's why no one makes them anymore. Car OEMs contracted out every component and system possible. Almost all the value in modern cars is various tiers of suppliers. There's a Mercedes model they contracted out even final assembly. They went to the same Jack Welch school of business that boeing did and thought they were clever not being responsible for anything and could just be middlemen pushing paper.

[FirmwareBurner]

>They went to the same Jack Welch school of business that boeing did and thought they were clever not being responsible for anything and could just be middlemen pushing paper.

Mercedes thought themselves to be untouchable due to it being a premium brand with high margins by putting a star on commodity parts, like they're a Swiss watch.

[kjellsbells]

That would have been fine, but they also simultaneously cheapened the brand by pushing out models aimed at younger less well heeled buyers. A Mercedes C class (US models) is like a slightly juiced up VW to me. Nice but not special at all.

Same impact as in fashion. Louis Vuitton can try and persuade us that they remain the choice of the world's wealthiest explorers, but when every two bit junior associate realtor is sporting an LV purse, I am not so sure.

Both brands fell for the growth at all costs mantra.

[FirmwareBurner]

It's OK, they're fixing their brand image by stopping selling their cars as Taxi vehicles. /s

[com2kid]

Historically the value was in knowing how to build reliable, clean burning, engines.

China never managed to catch up to other countries in terms of making combustion engines (it is incredibly hard, and from what I grok they were a generation or two behind), but EVs are mechanically much simpler.

What's more, BYD is following Tesla's playbook of vertical integration and making components inhouse to save money vs outsourcing everything.

[throwaway48476]

They also invested early in battery technology. China was able to build a competitive battery industry with state support and little environmental protection.

[com2kid]

The world is still waiting on a huge battery revolution to happen. It looks like it will actually happen Really Soon Now, and there are multiple technologies vying for first place. I hope someone with industry experience drops in and explains what is going on, because I haven't seen a comment like that here on HN for a couple years now. :-D

But honestly whoever gets 2x the density at the same cost will win, and it may be that incumbent advantages don't end up meaning much. AFAIK China's advantage isn't in much cheaper batteries, it is in cost savings everywhere else in making EVs.

For example, VW released a $60k USD EV minivan with mediocre range, and they thought that was a good idea. That sort of acceptance of mediocrity is why traditional automakers are going to get hammered into the ground, except instead of Japanese automakers teaching the lesson, this time it will be Chinese automakers. (Irony: At one point it was VW who helped teach American automakers the same lesson....)

[SideburnsOfDoom]

> The world is still waiting on a huge battery revolution to happen.

Revolutions like that don't happen on a given Tuesday. They ramp up over a decade or more. Would you notice that?

Would you notice if a faraway country passed a tipping point? https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/chinas...

Would you notice if a US state's electricity grid was transforming? https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2024/05/07/climate/batte...

[throwaway48476]

Amprius is shipping batteries with ~30% better mass density for 10x the cost. Other companies are shipping cheaper LiFePo. Battery applications are so diverse there's going to be many winners. I also wish someone would come and give a good market analysis.