[saturn8601]

>Huh? Hyundai has Tesla-tier automated factories that churn out EVs, and they’re building plants around the world. I don’t think they care who buys their cars.

They very much care if they are selling their cars to an entity that is striving to make them irrelevant.

Think about it: If the world moves to a car sharing system where any type of car is available on demand and no one actually owns a car, do you think anyone will actually give one hoot about the badge on the front of the car? That puts manufacturers into the worst possible business model. Competing solely on price...ie a commodity.

So the manufacturers will either not want to work with them, give them whatever junk they can't sell and then tell them to go away...or they expect to get something big in return maybe like some technology sharing or a exclusive partnership.

Why else has Waymo partnered with the bottom of the barrel OEMs up to this point? Why not a Toyota or a Mercedes or hell even get the good cars from the OEMs they have partnered with?

[conradev]

Waymo partnered with Hyundai on the Ioniq 5 because Hyundai just rolled out the first Ioniq 5 from their Georgia “metaplant” literally yesterday.

They’re one of the few companies mass-manufacturing affordable EVs in the US.

Toyota doesn’t make many EVs and none in the US? Mercedes doesn’t make affordable cars in general?

Waymo is clearly focused on cost reduction and EVs. Hyundai is clearly focused on selling as many Ioniq 5s in the US they possibly can (and most to consumers directly!). I don’t know, seems pretty clear cut to me.

I also don’t see any future in which Waymo builds a metaplant?

[saturn8601]

>Waymo partnered with Hyundai on the Ioniq 5 because Hyundai just rolled out the first Ioniq 5 from their Georgia “metaplant” literally yesterday.

What does one have to do with the other? The I-Pace was built in Austria. They dont seem to care about where it was built.

>Toyota doesn’t make many EVs and none in the US? Mercedes doesn’t make affordable cars in general?

The Chrysler Pacifica was a gas powered vehicle, The I-Pace had a starting MSRP of ~70k. They didn't seem to care about propulsion method or cost of vehicle either.

What they do have in common is that they were both poorly selling cars made by manufacturers that were desperate to sell.

>Waymo is clearly focused on cost reduction and EVs. Hyundai is clearly focused on selling as many Ioniq 5s in the US they possibly can (and most to consumers directly!). I don’t know, seems pretty clear cut to me.

Any evidence to prove this assertion?

Going back to my previous comment I mentioned that an OEM could want to partner with them if they got something meaningful out of the deal. Seems like thats what Hyundai is getting: Waymo Tech transfer/possibly an exclusivity agreement.

>I also don’t see any future in which Waymo builds a metaplant?

I never said or implied that they would.

[conradev]

Hyundai #2 to Tesla: https://www.businesskorea.co.kr/news/articleView.html?idxno=...

Waymo optimizing for cost: https://waymo.com/blog/2024/08/meet-the-6th-generation-waymo...

[saturn8601]

You ignored the rest of my response which is again driving the point: What does Hyundai really get out of this?

Circling back to my point, this does not really explain why they are partnering with Waymo. Waymo is a rounding error in sales for Hyundai.

If Waymo was solely focused on cost, then they should have stuck with the pacifica which is cheaper or gotten something even cheaper like a Toyota. It makes no sense to go with Hyundai which is not even the cheapest for the features that it offers(compared to id 4, Niro EV, Hell even Kona EV). It is a smaller car compared to the Pacifica and the i-Pace and is far less equipped in terms of comfort and space.

We dont even know if they specifically wanted to go with an EV. Thats just something you just asserted without evidence.

[conradev]

Waymo has touted that their entire fleet is now electric: https://waymo.com/blog/2023/03/paving-way-toward-fully-elect...

It sure seems like their self-imposed constraint is EVs. Their goal beyond that is cost reduction. It seems like the actual key right now might be volume:

“The team at our new manufacturing facility is ready to allocate a significant number of vehicles for the Waymo One fleet as it continues to expand. Importantly, this is the first step in the partnership between the two companies and we are actively exploring additional opportunities for collaboration.”

https://waymo.com/blog/2024/10/waymo-and-hyundai-enter-partn...

but to your point, Hyundai may see this as an opportunity for “future collaboration” to get autonomous driving tech into their vehicles. But selling a “significant number of vehicles” is also very much in Hyundai’s interest.

If Hyundai was making the Niro or Kona EV in the US, then they may have been an option, but they’re not. They are not eligible for the tax credit. Toyota won’t make EVs here until 2025 or 2026.

The ID.4 would meet that criteria, though, and I wonder if Waymo considered going with Volkswagen.

[saturn8601]

Uh that article is clearly a PR puff piece timed to coincide with the retirement of the Pacifica fleet which is nearing 5-6 years of service at that point.

Again given their strange choices in the past and their backpedaling on previous initiatives (having Chrysler produce special Pacificas and then going back to retrofitting them by hand themselves, going from commiting to purchasing 65k pacificas to NOT purchasing 65K Pacificas, getting Magna to go a custom design of the iPace for them to not having them do a custom design) I dont see this as a deal that Hyundai got into without major concessions.

>The ID.4 would meet that criteria, though, and I wonder if Waymo considered going with Volkswagen.

If my theory is correct I suspect they are not getting a warm reception from many manufacturers and they have to pick whatever they can get. I'd imagine their ideal company is Toyota. They have experience with those cars from the early days, they make cars that can help minimize downtime due to their reliability and costs can be reduced. There is a reason so many taxis are prisues. Why not apply that common sense cost savings to Waymo's fleet?