[Dalewyn]

The problem is (or at least was) with the people in political chairs playing power games. No amount of better regulations or technology can prevent fucking morons going on power trips screwing everything up and then get away with it.

The nuclear (TEPCO) people in the field were and are amazing, and it is a cardinal sin they got scapegoated for political purposes.

[kelnos]

But that's kinda the point: name one government in the world where politicians don't play political games, sometimes in ways that put their citizens in danger. I'm sure you can't, because no such government exists.

"Everything would have been fine if it weren't for the politicians" is not a path forward. These sorts of disasters will continue to happen.

[Dalewyn]

I agree, but then that should not be falsely characterized as a failure of the nuclear industry and technology. The failure was humans, and a very specific subset at that.

[natmaka]

> The failure was humans

Isn't it always true, for such matters?

As we cannot avoid committing errors it seems better to prefer a way without any risk of major accident (very dangerous radioactive things, difficult to cleanup, travelling long-distance thanks to wind, rain...). No wonder renewable sources quickly gain traction.

[Dalewyn]

Characterizing the failure of politicians as a failure of nuclear power is the error in logic I am talking about.

[natmaka]

Refusing to understand that everyone (politician or not) can fail and that if we now can replace something dangerous in case of failure (nuclear) by something new which isn't (renewables), we should do so... is the error in logic I am talking about.

[Dalewyn]

You're essentially arguing that kitchen knives should be banned because a small handful of psychos will murder someone with them.

That isn't how this works.

[teamonkey]

You cannot separate the human equation from the technology.

As I said: "The big problem with nuclear is not technological, it’s guaranteeing that whoever is responsible for it will be competent, capable and solvent for hundreds of years."

[pvaldes]

> should not be falsely characterized as a failure of the nuclear industry and technology. The failure was humans

Humans working in the nuclear industry are "the" nuclear industry. By definition all economical sectors are arranged around human workers. Remove each human and the industry will lose its reason to exist.

[krisoft]

> No amount of better regulations or technology can prevent fucking morons going on power trips screwing everything up and then get away with it.

I mean. If the story is true (which I have my doubts about). Then the simple change required would have been to make it clear that TEPCO has the sole authority to decide to scuttle the reactors. The politicians could have been morons going on a power trip all they wanted, and the reactors would have been safely scuttled.

If you are a firefighter you wouldn't ask the government if you should pump gasoline or water on a fire. Why did the people managing the nuclear reactors gave the government an opportunity to choose wrong? (Or rather, why was the system set up such that it was not already clearly defined under which technical circumstances the reactor must be be scuttled.)

[Dalewyn]

>why was the system set up such that it was not already clearly defined

For the simple reason that the 3/11 Tohoku Earthquake defied and rewrote essentially all the geological/maritime scientific and political expectations up to that point.

I doubt the same errors will happen today, but hindsight is 20/20.