[OrigamiPastrami]

> Not sure if it was the lesson he meant to impart though since I think most took away from it that to win you need to lie, cheat and steal.

Better to teach reality than ideology, assuming you want to be a practitioner instead of a theorist.

[paulryanrogers]

Nothing ever bad happened when societies trade high trust for low trust. No sir. All roses and sunshine. Certainly worthwhile for me to bend or break any rule keeping me from my best life.

[OrigamiPastrami]

Hating cheaters does nothing to change the reality of it being an effective method for getting ahead.

[paulryanrogers]

Only in narrow circumstances and only to a point. Or at least that's my (limited) understanding of game theory.

[OrigamiPastrami]

You're a caricature of my original point and you don't even realize it.

[paulryanrogers]

IME the reality is that trust erodes as cheating becomes widespread. The consequences of less trust are significantly higher costs and more stress and fear.

FWIW, I don't advocate blind trust.

Perhaps you meant to say we should teach the reality that cheating exists and is bad; not to pretend it doesn't exist? Or that it's hopeless to be honest and trustworthy because some others may not be? Which leads to ... apathy or more cheating and less trust.

[OrigamiPastrami]

I never said cheating is moral. I said cheating is advantageous. You think cheaters care that they're hurting society? You can't be a cheater without being selfish.

[keiferski]

It would if said cheaters were socially ostracized. Instead we make big budget movies about them, they get famous, and then earn money from the newfound attention.

[lazide]

And who’s fault is that exactky

[keiferski]

Presumably people that break the rules in a high-trust society, or at least those that enable the rule-breaking.

[lazide]

So…. everyone?

[Nasrudith]

The whole rhetoric of high trust society sounds like a fallacious argument from consequences against well deserved distrust by claiming it will basically lead to the collapse of society.

[Scene_Cast2]

I like Margin Call's quote - "be first, be smarter, or cheat".