[rubashov]

> No one has attained Enlightenment through Zen nor meditation

Maybe because no one has attained "Enlightment", whatever that means. Go say the rosary.

[calinet6]

> whatever that means

More profound than you realize. When you start to understand that, then you'll be closer.

It's really not that complicated or mystical.

[rubashov]

I understand it perfectly. You're a heathen. Submit to God.