[rglullis]

Right, because your outsourced cloud provider takes absolutely zero time of any application developers. Any issue with AWS and GCP is just one magic support ticket away and their costs already includes top priority support.

Right? Right?!

[dangus]

Heroku isn’t really analogous to AWS and GCP. Heroku actually is zero effort for the developers.

[JasonSage]

> Heroku actually is zero effort for the developers.

This is just blatantly untrue.

I was an application developer at a place using Heroku for over four years, and I guarantee you we exceeded the aforementioned 2-devs-3-days-per-month in man hours in my time there due to Heroku:

- Matching up local env to Heroku images, and figuring out what it actually meant when we had to move off deprecated versions

- Peering at Heroku charts because lack of real machine observability, and eventually using Node to capture OS metrics and push them into our existing ELK stack because there was just no alternative

- Fighting PR apps to get the right set of env vars to test particular features, and maintaining a set of query-string overrides because there was no way to automate it into the PR deploy

I'm probably forgetting more things, but the idea that Heroku is zero effort for developers is laughable to me. I hate docker personally but it's still way less work than Heroku was to maintain, even if you go all the way down the rabbit hole of optimizing away build times et.