[akira2501]

> The glitch and its aftermath represent a fascinating case study in the intersection of technology and human behavior.

The bank was asleep at the switch. There's absolutely nothing "fascinating" or worthy of study here, unless you're writing a love letter to the bank, hoping to help them avoid any responsibility for their own failures.

[toast0]

Are they really asleep at the switch? A little bit, I guess. An afterhours deposit probably shouldn't count as day 1 on a standard hold.

But deposits don't clear instantly, and banks routinely allow customers to access deposits or parts of deposits before they clear. Kiting checks is likely to result in serious consequences, and KYC means the bank has strong identification of their customers.

There's a good chance of criminal prosecution and an even higher chance of getting kicked out of banking. A negative chexsystems report makes it really hard to engage with the banking system, which makes life a whole lot more expensive.

But --- how much cash are people even getting out of this? Since the bank holiday is noted, I assume just ATM limits, which are usually around or under $1000/day (although I see an article that says $3000/day from chase operated ATMs).

That's enough to get in serious trouble, but not enough to start a new life. Doesn't seem worth it.

Most banks are set to 'fail open' during maintenance as well. If their systems are offline, you may be able to make repeated withdrawals from ATMs to go beyond your daily limit, and beyond your balance. This isn't being asleep at the wheel either; it's prioritizing availability over accuracy. In a high trust society, most account holders won't intentionally seek this out, and the few exceptions can expect major consequences.

[jerlam]

Most people don't know anything about how the banking system works. Anything beyond "you put your money in it, and you can take your money out with an ATM" is lost on most people. Checks are even more nebulous - it's an IOU that might be valid, or might not be. I still don't know why "post-dated" checks exist, or why my scribble on the back of a check suddenly makes it transferable.

Over 20 years ago, I bought and sold many items through online forums, and checks were common forms of payment. The prevailing advice was to wait a week or so after deposit for the check to "clear", meaning it was valid. Most young people have never used checks and have never been given this advice.

[akira2501]

> and an even higher chance of getting kicked out of banking

So you can never have them as a customer again for life. This is a fine strategy as long as the very small number of people who end up here do so intentionally and after much effort. Thus proving that they will always be more trouble than they're worth.

If it's a penalty for making a single mistake that you were enabled to make then this is not going to end anywhere good for any involved party.

> In a high trust society

This gets bandied about so often it's nearly meaningless now; however, on a basic level, I do not trust my bank. I'm guessing most of their current customers don't either. So they reap what they sow.

> This isn't being asleep at the wheel either; it's prioritizing availability over accuracy

Which made since in the 1970s. We're a bit past that now, and for a multi billion dollar institution to blithely allow this happen today is absurd.

[fallingsquirrel]

Suppose Chase's system has a momentary outage. Which headline would you rather see?

1: Three idiots on tiktok steal petty cash from the ATM and go to prison

2: Millions of Chase customers' lives grind to a halt as they can't withdraw cash to buy groceries

Or are you arguing for option 3: Software is perfect and we just simply never have any outages, ever.

[akira2501]

You have entirely detached yourself from the details of the story. These people deposited fake checks. Then withdrew against the fake balance. Stopping this outright is not going to stop people from buying groceries with real balance.

[lazyasciiart]

From the screenshots in the article, it looks like people are then transferring the money using online services. There are no limits I know of to how much you can spend on Venmo etc per day, so it could be life changing amounts.

[toast0]

Fair enough. But if you're going to send money you don't have through Venmo, do you need to deposit a fake check first?

I've not used Venmo, but Paypal doesn't know how much I have in my checking account, so why should Venmo?

[lazyasciiart]

Because it connects to your checking account to send the money.