Hacker News new | ask | show | jobs
by aguaviva 664 days ago
US shooting down a civilian passenger liner because of hypothesized secret cargo headed for China, and successfully covering it up for 10 years doesn't sound like something that passes Occam's Razor at all -- sounds like the very opposite, in fact.

One should look for theories with less sophistication, not more.
2 comments
epolanski 664 days ago
I obviously don't believe anything but deliberate murder-suicide by the pilot.

But just know that these things did happen.

There's lots of indications that surfaced recently that the Israeli air force secretly shoot down Itavia Flight 870 in 1980 to stop a transport of nuclear technology to Iran. They had mistaken the correct flight because their intelligence in France (were the uranium was being produced for Iran) pointed them in the wrong direction.

A very interesting book on the topic has been recently released with a deep and thorough investigation across France, Italy and Israel and it is to date the most credible and documented explanation for who shoot down the flight.

The book has been followed by quite a lot of investigative journalism in Italy that gives this theory lots of credit.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/213592261-il-quinto-scen...

link
ardaoweo 664 days ago
From Wikipedia:

"In 2023, former Italian prime minister Giuliano Amato said that France downed the plane while targeting a Libyan military jet in an attempt to kill Muammar Gaddafi. Amato said that Italy tipped off Libya about the planned assassination and consequently Gaddafi did not board the Libyan military jet"

To be honest, this theory of mistaken identity sounds much more plausible than anybody shooting down (or bombing) a random passenger plane flying an Italian domestic flight on purpose. Whether the presumably Libyan plane they actually targeted was transporting nuclear material or Gaddafi, I have no idea. Shame on them anyway for covering it up.

link
epolanski 664 days ago
That is an old theory that has been largely debunked by the book I suggested and the evidence that has surfaced recently. Not only that, but Israel was the only country in the planet that successfully showed to be able to traverse the mediterranean while avoiding completely radar detection flying thousands of miles at extremely low altitudes in Operation Wooden Leg[1] and some others.

Also Amato's words are quite meaningless as he never had an idea, and he was not prime minister at the time.

This reportage[2], albeit in Italian, aired by Italian state tv last year, starts by interviewing the person you quote Giuliano Amato, and he clearly points out that the government has never had a clear idea on who shoot it down. It goes into huge detail on all the elements behind the Israeli thesis and it's the only credible one for which he have substantial proofs, from the fact that France used civilian airplanes to transport uranium, to the fact that special cargo was indeed used on the very same flight (but in a different date), interviews with Israeli and French officials and Italian civilians that had seen fighter jets above the cost of Calabria and all pointed to Israeli fighters (albeit, not the F15s used in Operation Wooden Leg).

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Wooden_Leg

[2]https://www.rai.it/programmi/report/inchieste/Il-V-scenario-...

link
runxel 663 days ago
The US has done much much more nefarious things. I think it is totally possible – and convincing for that matter.

But another commenter already pointed out that she was pressed to write the book like that.

link