[baq]

I'm looking around for a good Linux laptop. Any recommendations?

I didn't check anything out in person, but have looked at reviews of framework, system76, thinkpads and there hasn't been one where there haven't been serious complaints (e.g. bent parts in some framework 16s causing the whole thing to rattle.)

(Is an M1 Air with Asahi a good idea?)

[t1c]

M1 with Asahi is a very bad idea, unless you want to be wrestling your computer to barely work. Either get a Framework laptop, or one of the new Asus Zenbook S 16 laptops (I just got one, and it's really nice. Works on Arch Linux with some kernel patches, which can be gotten pretty easily via the linux-mainline-um5606 AUR package).

[mightyham]

Maybe take another look at frameworks, they are by far some of the best laptops out there for computer people imo. Other than that, steer clear of system76. I've only bought one laptop from them a few years ago, but the build quality was astoundingly bad and after a year of use the battery couldn't last more than a couple hours.

[eikenberry]

They were still using rebranded Clevo laptops the last time I looked while their desktops are their own. There have been rumors they are working on their own laptops, but AFAIK nothing has materialized out of those.

So I'd say System76 is currently good for desktops. If you need a laptop them IMO frameworks are by far the best option right now. Modular laptops are great and makes problems like you've heard about super easy to remedy as you can just replace the parts easily yourself.

[bsimpson]

It's sad to know that the revenue stream that generates projects like COSMIC is dependent on "astoundingly bad" build quality.

[EasyMark]

Don’t eliminate a company based on an n=1 comment on HackNews, Reddit, etc.

[rqtwteye]

I’ll make it n=2. I was pretty disappointed by the build quality of my System 76 Galago. And it wasn’t very repair friendly either because parts are very difficult to get.

[nescioquid]

Make it three. I'm on the third battery for my darter pro: twice so far, the battery has swelled up and made the keyboard buckle. System76 support consists in selling me replacement batteries at a serious markup.

I've decided not to install the third battery, so I have more of a desktop now.

[bsimpson]

FWIW, the Ars reviewer installed COSMIC on a Framework and seemed to really enjoy it. They even sell a mini case that transforms their laptop into a desktop.

[tmtvl]

8 years ago I would have recommended one of Tuxedo's laptops, but unfortunately good laptops have become unfashionable as quality is getting sacrificed in the quest for being thin and small. You could try Slimbook, but they're also just Clevo resellers so it's more an 'everything works out of the box now' experience rather than 'the machine is great but patches for everything need to land in the kernel'.

[kombine]

I have Lenovo ThinkPad T14s Gen 3 AMD - it is the best Linux laptop I've ever had. They have 16" laptops too if you prefer this size.

[colordrops]

I just got a P14s Gen 5 AMD and it's amazing. Had a few issues but with firmware updates and some kernel param and TLP tweaks it's working perfectly. Well at least I haven't run into anything the last 3 days. Docking, undocking, sleep, graphics, etc.

[shrx]

I have it too and suspend / deep sleep doesn't work. Also haven't managed to get the fingerprint scanner authentication to work, and after waking up from hibernation the mic doesn't work anymore sometimes.

[mixmastamyk]

New AMD chips need a new kernel. Should be on 6.9 or 6.10 by now.

[baq]

Amazing news. Couple questions:

- how long does it take from lid open to lock screen?

- which distro are you using?

[chrsw]

I have a Dell XPS 13 Developer Edition from work that came with Ubuntu 20.04 preinstalled. Basically a flawless experience. I've posted about it on here before, I guess the Windows SKUs are slightly different? People reported different results when installing Linux themselves on top of machines that shipped with Windows.

I have a ThinkPad 25 for personal use with Debian and that's great too. For machines that I use routinely I don't have time for any issues.

[colordrops]

I have an old XPS from 7 years ago. Battery had to be replaced 4 times, and the build quality is shit. It also overheats and throttles really easily. Has that changed with newer models?

[chrsw]

I have an XPS 13 9310. I think the build quality is fine. The battery has never been replaced but it might be time:

  $ upower -i /org/freedesktop/UPower/devices/battery_BAT0 | grep energy-full
    energy-full:         33.5388 Wh
    energy-full-design:  50.9732 Wh

[zoidb]

Ive been pretty happy with my recent lemur system76 purchase. See https://www.reddit.com/r/System76/comments/1ehi5k6/initial_i... for details

[ewhanley]

I love my Framework 13. The ability to upgrade and repair is great, and they manage to fit it in an envelope comparable to other non-repairable units. The build quality feels solid. It's not a mbp, but the aluminum chassis feels a lot more robust than many plastic competitors.

[colordrops]

You haven't found a single Thinkpad without serious complaints? What kind of complaints?

[croutonwagon]

I manage a fleet of Thinkpads at work, all AMD for the most part.

W11 and AMD has been fun. We had to disaple CPU Power Management in Bios and disable fast reboot as systems would struggle to come out of sleep.

Multiple models had hardware issues, especially E series (which are desktop replacements for us). Many of the T series will have chassis intrusion just trigger constantly and require depot work to fix.

None of these are insurmountable but they cant be ignored. Still doesnt have me going to back to Dell's build quality and Intels heat issues. Most AMD laptops can run on power saver for 98% of our workloads and be fine.

[colordrops]

I've got a P14s Gen 5 AMD and am not running into any issues on Linux that I couldn't resolve. Just a sample of one though.

[croutonwagon]

Right. But im supporting these in a business environment with users that arent techy. Windows is basically needed. Privacy isnt even on the radar. And secuirty is handled via companies like crowdstrike.

[colordrops]

Yeah I hear you, sounds rough. Any experience with Linux on these devices? Windows BS isn't really an indictment of the hardware running Linux is it?

[croutonwagon]

Hardware generally is great. Biggest complaint is them swapping the fn and ctrl keys, but you can change that in bios.

Most common failure points have been

1. Usb-c going bad on e an l series.

2. Chassis intrusion going off on t x or p series. Which will halt boot and require the user to ack

[jwells89]

Not the OP, but while my X1 Nano runs Linux beautifully, its CPU and battery life are disappointing and it’s a bit on the slow side when unplugged, because getting what little battery life it’s capable of requires putting it in throttled down low power mode. It also spins up its fan for almost nothing.

I love the form factor, feel, weight, screen, etc… it’s really just the CPU that is ill-fit for the machine. I wish I could swap it out for a low-voltage Ryzen or Snapdragon, which would probably add 4-6 hours of life on the same battery.

This also doesn’t seem to be fixed on the newer Nano’s, which last I knew for some incomprehensible reason make use of higher power Intel Core models instead of the low voltage U-class CPUs that suit it better.

[baq]

The literally first google hit for L14 gen 5 in my filter bubble has a tldr of 'mixed bag'; granted, for an AMD SKU.

Would you recommend an Intel version?

[pantalaimon]

The L series are crap no matter what CPU

[Refusing23]

i have an E14 for work and its trackpad is garbage

same with the keyboard layout

[pantalaimon]

T and P series are good, X series can be so-so

L and E are Lenovo's entry/low cost models

[BoredPositron]

That "FN" Key placement boggles my mind.

[kombine]

Starting from T14 Gen 5 Ctrl is in the conventional position. On my Gen 3 I swap Ctrl and Fn in the bios.

[RattlesnakeJake]

Depending on the model, that's usually swappable with the left CTRL in the UEFI/BIOS settings.

[blactuary]

Dell XPS. The newest models inexplicably went to a touchscreen function row, but you can still get the 9315 from Dell for now. They have supported Ubuntu officially for years.

[darthrupert]

Framework seems to be much better in many ways than the current competition.

M1 Asahi remains a curiosity in my humble opinion.

[_lvbh]

I’ve been using Framework 13 batch 1 with Fedora for quite a long time. Never had any issues whatsoever. Everything works out of the box