[bayareateg]

I find that people often put on rose colored glasses when talking about the "old country," myself included. It is a little ridiculous to think that Greeks don't prioritize making money over some nebulous "community happiness"'

You should have asked her why she came to the US

[randomdata]

> It is a little ridiculous to think that Greeks don't prioritize making money over some nebulous "community happiness"'

She said that the people of her community prioritized happiness, not that the people prioritized community happiness. That might, for example, mean working less to enjoy more free time at the cost of maximizing profit. And, indeed, we can see in the data that the average worker in Greece takes 9 more vacation days each year as compared to their American counterparts.

[em500]

According to OECD data Greece workers work the most hours in the EU, and in most years also more than American workers[1]. So by that metric they prioritize happiness less than most others?

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_average_a...

[randomdata]

Or, perhaps, it isn't the happiness the person was referring to. After all, it was explicitly marked as an example, not what the person said. It could be that workers in Greece choose fun, but low paying, jobs to maximize happiness. Or maybe it is something else entirely.

[nanomonkey]

I'd assume that is because they take on jobs that they'll be happy with, instead of what ever job makes the most money. If you're content with what you do, you can do it sustainably for the rest of your life, if your only motivation to do your job is the money, then you'll burn out and retire early.

[victorbjorklund]

Not the case. People working in say fast food in Greece have 6 workday weeks (their weekends are just 1 day per week). Doubt people are more happy cleaning restaurant toilets in Greece vs the same toilets in US.

[dleink]

Having worked service industry jobs (US) I think there would be a dramatic increase in my quality of life had the customers been happier.

Not to mention the unrelenting psychic toll of working low wage jobs in a country with a weak social safety net.

[em500]

So if they work less hours than others it's because they prioritize happiness (grandparent's post), and if they work more hours than others it's alsmo because they prioritize happiness (your post)?

[randomdata]

The grandparent post was clearly stated as a hypothetical, so there is no expectation of it having any bearing in reality. However, what does seem to stand up to reality based on what data is available is that the people in Greece work more hours, but also take more days away from work.

Which may suggest that the "American way" is to work fewer hours per day, and then try to cram in some fun after work, whereas the Greeks allow themselves to delve into more fun over the span of entire days instead of short spurts. It is possible that more happiness is derived when one is able to enjoy themselves in larger blocks of time, even if the total quantity on a time-unit basis ends up being the same as anyone else. That would support both scenarios in the comments, even if they seem contradictory on the surface.

But, as with earlier comments, this is all based on hypotheticals for the sake of illustration. There is no indication of what the speaker from the greater thread was actually talking about.

[mbrumlow]

Happiness. What hell is it even? It means nothing.

Why? Because I am the most happy when working at a high paying job with loots of interesting problems to solve.

I would be the least happy working at a high paying job with nothing to do.

Happiness is a comparator, not a number. Money on the other hand can be counted, and thus can be measured. I am 100% sure every Greek ever would be more happy with more money given nothing else changed. Only somebody who found happiness through suffering would ask for less, and be more happy with less.

[sqeaky]

All of that is "I" and "me", not everyone. Happiness isn't meaningless, it just appears that you can't internalize someone else's internal state and understand how they might achieve happiness a different way than you.

[coldtea]

>Happiness. What hell is it even? It means nothing

Money means even less.

>Why? Because I am the most happy when working at a high paying job with loots of interesting problems to solve.

Yes, people have been conditioned to be working.

[mbrumlow]

I feel like your comment proves my point. On one hand I am saying what the hell is it even? And on the other hand you are telling ME my happiness is just "because I have been conditioned to work". You did zero to address what happiness is.

Money is a way to transfer resources. Resources make people happy. Somebody with no food for 3 days is happy when they finally get food. Money buys food, therefor money can buy happiness. People like to say the opposite, but they forget money can also buy unhappiness, or when talking bout the extreme cases where somebody has 20 billion, would 1 more billion have any affect on their happiness? Oh shit, we are back to WTF is even happiness. For all we know 1B more to the 20B guy might make them more happy because they are now richer than their enemy or some other happiness driven from the count of money.

We can break this down in other ways too. Some people say family is what makes them happy. I can tell you that a family of 12 with no money is less happy than a family of 12 with enough money. Its the difference between having shoes, or eating in may cases. Its clear that happiness is a compactor, and money can change the outcome.

[randomdata]

> Money on the other hand can be counted, and thus can be measured.

Not really. "1 money" is just a promise to deliver 1 unit of value in the future. But what characterizes the unit? What is the difference between one unit of value and two units of value?

In reality, we don't really know. It's a continual quest to try and figure that out and it changes on a whim.

[keybored]

Fascinating.

[hobs]

Pretty much every Greek that I have met (my father included) did it for a better future (money, no future with the military junta, american base left later.)

Plenty of Greeks have no interest in going back because they want the "American" life, but there's no question you ate better in the village, had more community, or had a sense of history - what you didn't have was more than ~35k euros a year, if you were lucky.

[mikrl]

A philosophical question is whether one could have it all?

Maybe the relative poverty fosters that kind of culture, and a high earning society necessarily becomes atomized, or perhaps atomized societies fosters high earning.

[wordpad25]

Being poor fosters comradery and social connections

Everyone knows everyone in a ghetto. Gated communities often don't know their next door neighbors.

[keybored]

> You should have asked her why she came to the US

People sometimes have rose-colored glasses about emigrating to the US.

[WalterBright]

My dad was in the AF, and we rotated back and forth between the US and Europe. A friend of his married a British woman while stationed there, and took her back to the States when the tour was over. She endlessly complained about the US, and how Britain was so much better.

Eventually, they were rotated to Germany. As soon as they arrived, she was off to England. 6 weeks later, she was back, and did not complain about the US again.

[keybored]

Legend has it that Walter can smell anti-Americanism in the water, in fact all the way to Germany.

[WalterBright]

My family did two tours in Germany (tour as in being stationed there by the military). If you're a military family, the military will move you all around the world.

[keybored]

Yes I guessed that AF meant Air Force.