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by derangedHorse 700 days ago
At the end of the day you're just having a value disagreement with those of us who are Bitcoin proponents. You don't think the energy is worth what Bitcoin brings the world, while we do. Bitcoiners seem to jump through hoops to prove that they are leading the way in clean energy generation and consumption, yet to you *any* energy spent on Bitcoin will always be a waste.

This makes the only acceptable energy for Bitcoin to morally use be self-generated, clean, and has no impact to you whatsoever. A failure to recognize this fundamental belief will always lead to you belaboring your point. The only thing I can leave you to think about is whether you truly believe Bitcoin is the biggest "waste" of energy for you, or why there aren't as many conversations about the consumption of the rest of the 99% of energy demand (the CBECI estimates Bitcoin took about 0.1% - 0.9% of global electrictity demand[1]).

[1] https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php
1 comments
throw0101d 700 days ago
> At the end of the day you're just having a value disagreement with those of us who are Bitcoin proponents. You don't think the energy is worth what Bitcoin brings the world, while we do.

There are two different points:

* Bitcoin is useful in some way

* Bitcoin 'soaks up' energy that would otherwise be "wasted"

In this thread I am saying there is no such thing as "wasted energy" (regardless of the pros and cons of Bitcoin).

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RustyRussell 697 days ago
When solar or wind is curtailed, I would call that wasted energy?
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throw0101d 697 days ago
How many coins were mined in 2023? How many transactions were completed in 2023? What percentage of each used this "wasted energy"? 100%? 75? 35? Other?

And even if mining used only energy/electricity that would otherwise be "wasted", so what? If cryptocurrency mining was never invented in the first place, the energy production would be curtailed because it wouldn't be needed to begin with, and there would be no net loss.

So the production of some (unneeded) energy is curtailed, so what? Not needing energy in the first place is hardly a hardship on society (and the environment).

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