[miah_]

I grew up here and left as soon as I turned 18! After living all over the US and trying out different cities and locales returning to Michigan made the most sense. Buying a home in the SFBay area isn't feasible unless you're willing to work multiple jobs or sell your soul to FAANG.

Want a house? Get ready to replace: The foundation, the roof, the sewer lateral, oh and the addition wasn't done with a permit so its not to code at all. All for the low low price of $500k! On a lovely 1/4th acre plot, you'll be hearing your neighbor while they fart in the bathroom. What, you only got $500k? Don't worry, this other person here has $550k and they don't have a problem with the house need to be rebuilt!

Oh I'm looking at $500k houses? I should be looking at 1.1mil houses to not deal with all those problems? Now I've got 1.1mil mortgage for 30 years. I don't want to work into my 70's for a house.

Compared to... come to Michigan, you can get 5 acres for less than $300k and your house is functional, maybe it needs a new roof within 5 years. My mortgage is 15 years and will be paid off before that.

I think "competition" is the big thing that drove me back home. I was tired of competing with my neighbors (people who live in the same city) for _everything_. I don't mind people, I loved meeting people in every city I lived. I just felt like I had to fight for every "inch" in most "big cities" (but especially SFBay area).

It's very peaceful here. I love it. Maybe I'll go to the big lake (Michigan) later and swim.

[ethbr1]

Agreed that competition is one of my major annoyances with big cities.

Once it gets big enough that "good" restaurants require a reservation any day of the week, and those reservations are difficult to get, I'm moving somewhere else.

Why work to fight to win... what you can just enjoy somewhere else?

[fragmede]

To be a total snob about it, it's because the "what" is better in some places. If the best restaurant in town is a Cheesecake Factory or Olive Garden, and there are no reservations; hey, you do you.

[ethbr1]

Fair!

But there's a pretty big swath of cities between {Cheesecake Factory} and {Manhattan}.

[fragmede]

Yeah, Manhattan sounds crazy. I was reading this whole article about this platform for NYC restaurant reservations, where people who book reservations at a restaurant can turn around and sell those reservations on the platform.

[mdip]

Michigan's housing prices vary pretty dramatically and we don't have a terribly low cost of living in parts -- especially real-estate. It's no SFBay, but it's rapidly getting worse.

You mentioned the 300,000 on 5 acres, and that's definitely possible, but you're not getting that in the desirable parts of Macomb or Oakland County[0], nor anywhere in Wayne outside of Detroit/Detroit-ish areas.

I watched a house on a busy city road (one where "pulling out of the driveway means an immediate traffic backup to the light" between 7-9 and 4-6 every day) which was 2,200 sq ft, 4 BR 2.0 BA, though it was new construction (relatively modern/upgraded interior) go for $550,000 in 2022 after multiple bids. The home I own (1800/3BR/1.5BA) which I purchased for $175,000 in 2001 and would have lost money had I sold it between 2007~2018, is worth about $330,000. This is partly due to the value increasing due to local changes and "what's happening everywhere in the country" housing prices-wise. I know folks who moved to Plymouth to a home with similar specs but paid a quarter million in 2017.

Cool. And because I didn't re-finance, I don't have a mortgage any longer. Except I want to upgrade. And had I done that in 2008, I could have afforded it. Now that upgrade is twice as much but my salary has not followed suit. My desire to upgrade went to near zero, already, once I paid it off. But now I couldn't even afford to if I wanted to. I figure I'll downgrade and move near the kids when they're older and take home some cash in the process.

One thing I love about where I live in Michigan, though ... it's rare that a house doesn't have a basement. Even in places you wouldn't expect -- our next-door neighbor on Lake Huron had a full basement with 12ft ceilings (and a hell of a system to keep it bone dry). And newer homes tend to have excellent ones you can make useful -- if not always up-to-code -- living/lab spaces out of. SFBay hacks in their garage. We hack in our basements.

[0] When people say they "Live in Detroit" that's probably where they live. Just like the Detroit Zoo.