[advael]

Perhaps that seems obvious to you. I don't view it as obvious that anyone's individual health decisions should ever be made and enforced by the state. It is obvious to me that trying to "regulate" these choices through a prohibition framework is not only ineffective, but does massive harm. However, since we're arguing about that very question, I don't feel it sufficient to merely say "it's obvious" and leave it at that.

The Volstead act didn't save us from the evils of alcohol, but it did put a lot of people in jail, strengthen organized crime, and create a reactionary push for more draconian police powers. The difference now is that the Controlled Substances Act and its international equivalents are backed by more technologically powerful governments, and cover more substances. Even in the early 20th century, prohibition policies created powerful criminal cartels and draconian police states. The controlled substances act has created both in spades, and the downstream consequences are so vast that they have arguably defined the society we live in, with its mass-incarceration, constant surveillance, and at least in the US, an incredibly punishing, byzantine, and costly healthcare system

[manuelmoreale]

I’m not going to comment on the second part because I don’t live in the US and I have no idea what the situation is in your corner of the world on that front.

As for the first part, you said you don’t agree about the state having a say in your health but the original problem was related to selling all sorts of drugs openly.

Do we both agree that at some point some limitation has to be put in place otherwise some people would just abuse such a system? Or do you think we should just let people do whatever and then the role of a society is to help those who end up abusing those drugs?

Because it’s happening already, people are already abusing all sorts of drugs even with some restrictions in place.

And mind you, I’m not arguing for criminalization. I’m just arguing for adding at least some regulation like requiring a prescription. I see that as a good middle ground.

But maybe it’s just me being raised here that makes me see things differently than you, that’s always a possibility.

[advael]

I don't think there's any productive place to put restrictions on what drugs adults are allowed to buy of their own volition. It's not the government's job to make sure I'm making the best decisions for my health, and by and large it doesn't in any other context. I really do think people should talk to their doctor and get their expert advice on what drugs to use, when to use them, and what to look out for. I think a lot of the time a doctor should say "No, you really ought to avoid that drug. Here's why". Creating a situation where this has legal weight and can wind you up in jail, no matter how you frame it (Like what's the penalty for getting a drug without a prescription?) is doing harm.

Even without the jailtime, if we assume some people need certain drugs, and they just can't afford to talk to a doctor, or can't get an appointment for 6 months, and at best can hope to go through a process of needing to circumlocute to avoid seeming "drug-seeking" while trying to ask advice about a particular drug and get legal permission to buy it, that restriction is harming those people. I don't think a doctor telling you not to try a drug should mean you can't make that decision for yourself. I don't think more people taking adderall should trigger an investigation into doctors that decides that too many of them gave their patients that clearly wanted adderall the permission they needed to buy it. This pits doctors against their patients inherently

We absolutely should use the government to regulate sellers of drugs. We should crack down significantly on false advertising, doctors being paid to push drugs, and poor quality control practices within manufacturing operations. This is something we do inadequately under the current regime. We absolutely can't do it for black market operations. People who want drugs that are illegal currently don't have an option they can really trust to the level of things government health agencies vet. Creating demand for black market drugs by locking people out of regulated ones causes any effort the government makes regulating the sales/manufacturing side of drugs to be useless for those people