[_flux]

As I understand it, lead in gasoline was used for motor longetivity, but other approaches have been invented to reduce pollution. So now we use only (or just mostly?) unleaded gasoline, which is used basically the same as leaded.

What's your microplastic-free alternative to replace most uses of plastic? Microplasticless plastic that would work for all plastic use cases doesn't exist, as far I know.

[littlestymaar]

You don't need a one-size-fits-all solution to all problems at once. But most plastic use have alternative solutions, if you are willing to change industrial practices (plastic-less supply chains will look very different for instance).

[_flux]

There are, and we do use them, more and more every day (from my simple consumer point of view), but it's much more difficult to dictate that "everyone" must switch to non-microplastic solutions, like it seems to have been possible with gasoline.

What would that kind of legislation look like? It would be bound be huge, have negative non-intended consequences, and loopholes.

Maybe a global plastic tax could function as a guiding force, but even that has the negative consequence increasing the costs of stuff that just doesn't have alternatives. It would funnel money towards developing plastic-free products.

But getting everyone onboard with that is difficult—and I presume it's difficult to put a fair plastic tax for imported products.

[littlestymaar]

> and loopholes.

This is an argument that comes again and again when discussing government intervention and really baffles me: don't you laissez-faire guys really don't realize that a “loophole” is still much tinier than a completely open door?!

[_flux]

Loophole can be small, but when exploited properly, an elephant can walk right through it. And you also chose to ignore the part about unintended consequences..

All it really takes to even consider moving into this direction is to propose a solution to this. "Stop plastic" is not it due to practical reasons. I wouldn't know what a proper solution would be, nor would I have the expertice to recognize one when proposed, but is there even a realistic proposal?

[throwaway48476]

The problem is plastic is not one thing but an entire category of materials. There are plenty of places plastics can be designed out but there's also an awful lot where it's never going to be possible to replace. For example operating rooms have huge trash bins because everything comes plastic wrapped for sterility.

[mattkrause]

Even in ORs, there are options for using less plastic use. For example, drapes can be single-use (paper-lined plastic in a plastic pouch) or fabric (wrapped in more fabric and autoclaved).

I agree that getting to zero plastic is probably impossible—-it has amazingly useful properties for some applications—-but it’s also used for convenience and other mundane reasons (e.g., less liability if you offload sterilization to the manufacturer).

[littlestymaar]

> For example operating rooms have huge trash bins because everything comes plastic wrapped for sterility.

First of all we don't need disposable plastic for that… And wrapping it in Kraft paper would work exactly the same way!

[mrguyorama]

>lead in gasoline was used for motor longetivity

Nope. Tetra-Ethyl lead as a fuel additive, primarily for octane boosting, was invented as a "cheaper alternative" to what would normally be used to boost octane: Ethanol. Surely for only coincidental reasons, having a chemical product that they could patent and prevent anyone else from manufacturing made them a whole lot more money than using Ethanol which anyone could make and market and compete.

Leaded gas was a fucking profit motivated thing.

The point of us putting ethanol in gas is multifaceted, but not even remotely about climate change: The octane booster we used after we removed was MTBE. MTBE had a problem where it would constantly leak out of fuel storage and poison families, cause birth defects, you know, toxic shit. So we FINALLY just said fuck it, put ethanol in gas like we should have been doing since the 20s.

Other effects it had: Immediately reduce US gasoline usage by 10%. Subsidy to farmers.

[throwaway48476]

It was to reduce knock which was solved with electronic fuel injection.

[littlestymaar]

Idk what modern injection can do for that, but it wasn't even needed, the original solution was to use other additives instead of lead.

[serf]

every modern injection system that has authority over ignition and cam timing can monitor knock via microphone and adjust accordingly.