[JohnFen]

I actually think this sort of thing is a huge part of SV-style companies are increasingly viewed in a poor light by normal people.

It's hubris. The mindset takes "People don't know what they want. We do." far, far too seriously.

[edmundsauto]

I think it’s much more nuanced. Remember Ford’s “we make cars in everyone’s favorite colors (As long as it’s black)”

When you’re making a product you have to spin up the flywheel with marketing in order to get accurate feedback from customers.

The previous method was to use focus groups to make new products. That was far worse.

Even harder, nowadays the biggest impact comes from platforms instead of products. Multi-sided marketplaces are even more challenging.

It’s not hubris, it’s collective complexity, increasingly sophisticated consumers, and less low hanging fruit.

[JohnFen]

> The previous method was to use focus groups to make new products. That was far worse.

I actually don't think that was worse at all, and focus groups should come back into the equation. Not as the only measure, of course, but they were never the only measure.

[edmundsauto]

The problem with focus groups is 1) people say they want different things than they actually do, and 2) it's rarely representative, you'd need thousands of people. Then, once scaled, you lose details because it has to be more survey-like. Add in the leadership team's "vision" and you have a recipe for only making products for e.g. white men and ignoring the black woman haircare market.

It all has a place - but actual real data is probably the best way to figure out product market fit in my experience.