[mvdtnz]

I work with two people who survived PIPs and are now productive members of my teams. I wasn't the manager involved, but I think she made a good choice, both when she PIP'ed them and by passing them when they picked up their game. This is going to vary company to company, but from my perspective there's absolutely no reason a capable person can't get themselves out of a PIP and remain at a company.

[xnx]

> from my perspective there's absolutely no reason a capable person can't get themselves out of a PIP and remain at a company.

Many (possibly most) companies use PIPs as a pretense for a firing decision that has already been made. In those companies it is a fool's errand to try and improve your performance (because performance may have nothing to do with it). You cannot win. You should feel lucky that you only seem to have encountered legitimate pips where both sides are hoping for improved performance.

[travisb]

In most cases the firing decision has already been made because all the sustainable levels of informal support have already been exhausted.

After the team lead has endlessly explained, reassigned, and simplified a person's tasks, and just generally tried their best to make the person a productive member of the team _and failed_, then they've given up and put them on a PIP so they can be let go.

AFAICT PIPs are must CYA's.

[xnx]

I don't doubt there are genuine performance reasons for some PIPs, but there are countless political reasons too. A direct report may make a manager look bad by knowing more than them, question their decisions, have favor in other parts of the organization, etc. Many managers can only succeed by extinguishing any dissent and hiring beholden loyalists.

[apple4ever]

Sure some do that, but I have not run into that in my career. Its never "a decision has been made" but "lets give them one more chance". Personally, if a decision has been made, you just cut them. No reason to go through the process.