[longsword]

i'm really glad that i can use my own modem. In germany every ISP is by law required to accept self brought modems. They can't force you to use their often shitty hardware. My current modem/router is up for 3 months without a single interruption to my connection.

[aidenn0]

Can the ISP load firmware onto your modem? I'm on Cox in the US (same ISP as in TFA) and you can bring your own modem, but Cox will remotely update the firmware.

[longsword]

No, they can't. They don't have any access at all to your device. But as jeduardo already said, you can fetch updates from the device manufacturer. The mentioned Fritz!Box from AVM has automatic updates and is known for delivering them for a really long time. My 12 year old repeater from that brand is still receiving security updates from time to time.

[jeduardo]

Not really as far as I know. Providers in Germany have more or less standardized on Fritz!Box from AVM and the router comes with the admin password available. Updates are then fetched from upstream AVM.

But the key point here is device independence - by law, providers need to give you all information required to establish a connection to them. This allows you to run a Linux or BSD box as a router should you wish to. It somehow makes up for the slow broadband speeds you can get.

*Edit: complaints about slow broadband speeds

[aidenn0]

Are there Linux or BSD boxes with ADSL or DOCSIS physical layers present? I use a separate modem and router, as do most people in the US that are not renting equipment from their ISP.

[nness]

I've noticed it gets quite murky when dealing with fibre-to-the-premises, particularly in the UK. Although I don't think an ISP would disallow BYOD, I imagine they'd just not be as likely to support it.

I recently moved ISP, partly because of cost, but also because they offered a great home router as part of their bundle. The installer could not utilise any of the existing wiring in my house, had to be all drilled a second time...

Conversely, my last ISP used some awful Nokia modem that barely supported any kind of routing or customisation and I picked them specifically because it was a rental and the fibre wiring had already been done.

It's fairly common for ISP's in Australia to also give you a choice of BYOD or buying one of theirs. Usually you pay outright for the modem, however, so its yours to keep. That said, this is changing with the national fibre roll-out. But with ADSL being the de-facto choice, BYOD makes sense.

[vladvasiliu]

> I've noticed it gets quite murky when dealing with fibre-to-the-premises, particularly in the UK. Although I don't think an ISP would disallow BYOD, I imagine they'd just not be as likely to support it.

In France, I've noticed that some ISPs (Free for FTTH and SFR for FTTC + cable attached to the router) they'll offer the possibility of configuring the provided router in "bridge" mode, where you basically get the external IP to whichever equipment is hooked up to their router.

I've also had FTTH with SFR, which have a separate device which terminates the optical connection (ONT) and speaks ethernet with the main router. I don't remember if the main router was able to work in bridge mode. It was possible to connect your own router to the ONT but you had to jump through hoops [0] to actually receive a working DHCP response.

Bouygues also had the separate device for terminating the optical connection, connected via ethernet to the main router. The only catch was that it talked over vlan 100 for some reason, but other than that it was smooth sailing.

I've never had Orange, but I hear it's a pain to replace the actual router with them.

---

[0] IIRC you had to send some custom DHCP options pretending more or less to be an actual SFR router.

[longsword]

BYOD is really easy here with DSL. With fibre they try to push the legal limits by arguing that their device is required because its part of their network. But because the law explicitly says the network has to end at a passive point, they got fined. If they don't provide the login and vlan id's, you can just report them to the authorities and they will handle it.

[tengwar2]

I've got FTTP in the UK (from Andrew's and Arnold). There's a provided bridge which takes the fibre connection and relays PPPoE to my own router. I believe that's a common way to do it.

[edward28]

With Aussie NBN most providers use pppoe or dhcp, which allows byod or ISP router.

[llm_nerd]

I use the ISP's modem (separating my own choices from having to worry about upgrades to DOCSIS and the like), but then hang my own router off of it. For that matter I have multiple routers inside the cable router for various tiers. With secure DNS and almost universal TLS, and then the firewall that are the internal private networks, the threat profile is negligible.

[imzadi]

FWIW, you can use your own modem and router with Cox internet, but most people don't because the provided modem is free and most people don't care to spend money on their own.

[matthew-wegner]

Cox can (and does) push firmware to bring-your-own modems, though.