[zamadatix]

The drift (a second every ~1.5 years) is so small the accumulation is irrelevant to biological processes. 2000 years from now it does not matter that solar time has drifted ~an hour. Beyond "what people millennia ago used to do at 7 we do at when the clock says 8" not being a problem (assuming we even live similar lives) I'll be god damned if we can stop ourselves from changing zones and whether or not we'll observe DST this year for the next 20 years let alone what else we'll muck up in the next 2000.

TAI will still be there and needed by folks. UTC is stopping adding leap seconds in the future, not reverting back as if it never had any.

[throw0101d]

> The drift (a second every ~1.5 years) is so small the accumulation is irrelevant to biological processes.

It is irrelevant until it is not: just ask Julius Caesar and Pope Gregory XIII.

> Beyond "what people millennia ago used to do at 7 we do at when the clock says 8" not being a problem […]

The difference of an hour does make a difference, as sleep researchers and chronobiologists keep pointing out every time a discussion on DST comes up (it is not just about the sudden time jump, but also about the actual time):

* https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fphys.2019.0094...

* https://sleepresearchsociety.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/...

* https://srbr.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/SRBR-Statement-o...

* http://www.chronobiocanada.com/official-statements

[01HNNWZ0MV43FF]

If a difference of an hour that's been there your entire life is noticeable, we should be able to observe that as a discontinuity of quality of life at time zone boundaries.

[zamadatix]

> It is irrelevant until it is not: just ask Julius Caesar and Pope Gregory XIII.

You're refferring to needing to reform the entire calendar but this doesn't make sense in context of me explaining that the calendar itself never needs to be reformed in the first place. That the sun was a few degrees different in the sky for Julius Caesar when a modern clock reads 3 PM in his time is not inherently a problem as Julius Caesar wouldn't have the same norms as you do in terms of what wall time is acceptable for waking/sleeping/eating/working/etc. E.g. 20,000 years from now if a clock reads 3 AM during midday it' not a problem as society will have had 20,000 years to adjust 12 hours vs your referenced calendar reforms that changed everything overnight.

> The difference of an hour does make a difference, as sleep researchers and chronobiologists keep pointing out every time a discussion on DST comes up (it is not just about the sudden time jump, but also about the actual time):

Again, you're missing the forest through the trees - though in two different ways here. The first is that it's a minute over someone's (long) life, so what impact we feel when we change time by an hour twice a year isn't relevant. The second is that society, over 2,000 years, does not need to change timekeeping itself to wake up when the clock says 8 instead of 7. If the change were to happen over a short period then sure, it's not really feasible for society to move up what wall time their breakfast is four times a year or something, but an hour a millenia isn't even something society needs to consciously worry about.

My point is not that we don't have a biological clock, it's that the effect of leap seconds on a human's biological clock are too small to affect it. One of your sources already says it's 15-20 minutes misaligned a day, why are you using it to argue 1 additional minute for your entire life is impactful? On the long term societal scale my point is society won't always agree we should wake up when the wall clock says 7 am. That norm changing shifting ~an hour 2,000 years is not a relevant concern for changing the way we keep time.

[philwelch]

> The difference of an hour does make a difference, as sleep researchers and chronobiologists keep pointing out every time a discussion on DST comes up (it is not just about the sudden time jump, but also about the actual time)

Do any of these sleep researchers have anything to say about France using CET instead of GMT even though CET is about an hour off from their natural time? Or Spain being on CET despite being almost another hour off from France?

Furthermore, how long is it going to take for the accumulated leap seconds to add up to a full hour of time? My understanding is that it’s on the order of centuries. If humanity can maintain an industrialized civilization that’s capable of keeping track of leap seconds for that long, most of us won’t even be living on the earth by the time it makes any difference.

[throw0101d]

> Do any of these sleep researchers have anything to say about France […]

Perhaps ask French Sleep Research and Medicine Society (Société Française de Recherche et Médecine du Sommeil):

* https://www.sfrms-sommeil.org

* https://esrs.eu/national-sleep-society/france/

See also Spain:

> Human rhythmicity is subjected to the workings of the internal circadian clock, but it is also influenced by environmental time (mainly the light-dark cycle) and social timing imposed by the official time at our location, as well as by our work schedule. When a misalignment among these times occurs, an internal order impairment appears, which affects our health. Western Spain (GMT+1/+2) and Portugal (GMT0/+1) share similar longitudes (sun time) but have different official times, and thus they provide a “natural experiment” to assess how this discrepancy affects circadian rhythmicity and sleep in people with no work duties (>65 years). Although sleep duration was not affected, the circadian rhythms in the Portuguese were more robust, especially during weekdays, while higher desynchronization tended to occur in the Spaniards. Once official time was corrected by GMT0, meals took place later in Spain than in Portugal, especially as the day progressed, indicating the possible deleterious effect on circadian system robustness when official time is misaligned with its corresponding geographical time zone.

* https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9404853/