[kqr]

This one surprises me because it seems far more common to me that cars hold up traffic than bicycles. When you look at images of traffic jams it's almost always other cars in the way, not bicycles.

I suppose maybe it's a city/countryside thing? Cars are great at long straights, but they take forever to safely clear an intersection compared to a bicycle -- and they block most of the road while they do.

[stouset]

It’s an outgroup thing.

It’s “normal” to be held up by traffic. It’s novel being delayed by a cyclist. Plus you’re doing something important and their leisure is getting my way!

When a cyclist does something unexpected, it’s extremely dangerous; pay no mind that they’re the one in 95% of the danger. When a fellow driver speeds, rolls through a stop sign, or fails to yield it’s lost in a sea of normalized deviance. No matter that car accidents are a leading cause of death.

[matsemann]

Yup. I have coworkers driving to work complain to me about some cyclist they met on the way to work. Like, why..? I'm not responsible for that just because I also bike. It's not like I harass every driver I meet at work just because some driver killed a child again in the city.

And all their interactions with stupid drivers? Quickly forgotten a moment later.

[nemo8551]

I’m a mountain biker, I even internally complain about some road cyclists.

The ones who take up far more of the road than necessary, granted because they can, and slow you down prior to traffic lights meaning you hit a red.

But when you hit a red, they swerve onto the pavement, across the junction with the pedestrians and then onwards beyond the red light while I’m still sat at the red. All while not dismounting from their bike.

In the UK, where I live they should stop at the light and not pretend to be a pedestrian. But they’re also entitled to the road, but when they ride in a manner that means I would have to veer well into the oncoming lane to get around them it’s just not worth it. A wee bit if there’s no traffic is fine, but not too much.

[matsemann]

Of course you should use the opposite lane when passing? Hence it shouldn't matter to you where they're placed in the lane, as you should leave ample space when passing anyways and move over.

Isn't it also better for you that the cyclists get a head start, thus you're not stuck behind them in your scenario?

[agumonkey]

Agreed. It's also why I stopped using main streets, I drive on small, abandoned paths as much as possible, and when I get near others (car or pedestrians) I slow down or let everybody do what they want until I can branch out again. Any issue you may have with others will become a senseless shouting contest.

[globular-toast]

Exactly. Being "stuck in traffic" is a car thing. Pedestrians and cyclists are literally never "stuck in traffic".

[ndsipa_pomu]

You're mainly correct, but if you have a look at busy times in a bike-oriented city such as Copenhagen then there are big queues of bikes/trikes at traffic lights. Maybe "paused in traffic" would be a better description of them though.

[globular-toast]

Traffic lights only exist because of cars, though. Pedestrians and cyclists don't need them. So, again, it's all caused by cars.

[ndsipa_pomu]

I agree with your sentiment, but traffic lights pre-date cars - the first ones were around the Houses of Parliament (UK) in 1868 and there were manually controlled ones in the U.S.A. at the beginning of the 20th century before there were large numbers of cars.

However, modern traffic lights tend to be designed exclusively for motorised traffic and here in the UK it's annoying because we don't have a "turn left on red" rule, so cyclists can end up waiting at a red light even though a left turn would be perfectly safe. I got caught out the other day at a set of lights that didn't detect me on my carbon bike, so I sat patiently waiting (the other roads were busy) until I figured out that my turn had been missed and had to carefully find a gap to make my turn.

The other thing is that stopping and starting on a bike takes significant energy and effort, so a straight road with many lights can turn an easy commute into a chore which is why it's common to see cyclists going through red lights. Interestingly, that kind of red-light jumping is allowed under some jurisdictions e.g. Paris.

[globular-toast]

Those early ones were for horse-drawn carriages (cars).

[eptcyka]

Having a bunch of cyclists take up a whole lane width wise will always be frustrating. I bike every day and drive reatively rarely, but I understand the frustration with cyclists. I am also scared to death that one day I’ll turn a corner on a country road and get to decide between heading into oncoming traffic or plowing a group of cycling buddies doing 75% of the speed other vehicles normally will do on said country road.

[ndsipa_pomu]

Why go so fast that you can't stop in the distance you can see to be clear? That's just poor driving.