[slily]

The idea is to stand up for the weaker party and that's it. It doesn't matter that Palestine is led by a terrorist group with a genocidal agenda with overwhelming popular support. They are weaker and therefore they can't be wrong, by virtue of being weaker they are automatically classified as oppressed and deserving of pity, whilst Israel being the stronger party makes it automatically the bad oppressive party in cartoon style. See also how no one doubts the obviously cooked numbers on Palestinian deaths. You can see this rationale mirrored exactly in the disproportionate criticism of Western states and specifically white settlers.

[petee]

Many could say the same of Israel.

But don't conflate protests against Israel as being in support of Hamas. Many people support neither, but are horrified how kids are bearing the brunt. Hamas commited attrocities, so has Israel; all lose in war.

[slily]

I agree in principle, but I don't see many protesters demonstrate that nuance.

[petee]

Personally I've never seen a "pro-Hamas" sign, I have no doubt someone somewhere has one. Ive seen plenty of "Free Palastine" signs be called anti-semitic though, despite showing support for the people versus a government.

[ergocoder]

> I have no doubt someone somewhere has one.

I've seen two.

The protesters at UW organized a protest for palestine on Oct 12th with the Hamas glider in its poster. Many people joined the protest.

5 days after the massacre!

You can see the poster here: https://komonews.com/news/local/israel-hamas-war-palestine-g...

The pro-palestine protest in San Francisco was chanting "From the river to the sea"

[theoldlove]

I don’t see any signs in those photos that are explicitly pro Hamas. Which sign are you referring to?

[ergocoder]

Here

https://komonews.com/resources/media/b8ce76d2-e339-40e2-b077...

[raxxorraxor]

In my opinion, protesting just after the events in October is a message itself too. My understanding for their griefs is very, very limited here.

That of course is not applicable to these sit-ins, although I wouldn't want to support them either.

[pyeri]

That "River to Sea" phrase has a very sinister and evil meaning when you look up the original Arabic. Translations are always polished for mass appeal!

[slily]

I see Jews being harassed, synagogues vandalized, 4chan-tier anti-semitic conspiracy theories going around leftist circles, and more broadly I see social media armchair activists who may or may not be relevant but do affect public opinion parroting Hamas propaganda wholesale, and the protesters featured in this post's article exemplify exactly that mentality which is what I was initially describing. Most people are reasonable, but I'm not concerned with people who know the difference between a hot war and a genocide.

[jeromegv]

When I see aid trucks being attacked by the army but also by protestors while the UN declares millions of people at risk of starvation, I know we are past a “hot war”.

[slily]

As far as I know, friendly fire and collateral damage are a reality in all hot wars, especially in situations such as this one where one side attempts to blend in with civilians, so I don't see how this is different. The good and bad of the Internet is that in the sea of information you can pick and choose your truth. Was Israel's killing of aid workers intentional or was it collateral damage? All I know is that Hamas was shown cooking up numbers and lying systematically and that's the side everyone believes for some reason. When their lies are exposed they are simply replaced with more or with some disproportionate criticism of errors committed by the IDF.

[richrichie]

FYI 4chan is extremely islamophobic too. They don’t discriminate much.

[slily]

I read /pol/ occasionally like I read far-left commentary and I can assure you that they portray Hamas/Iran/anyone aligned against Israel or openly anti-semitic as a gigachad. If Jews were wiped off the face of the Earth then sure they'd pick a secondary target, probably Muslims.

[matsemann]

Then you're blind. I've not seen a single person at these protests where I live supporting Hamas. The protests are all about stopping the murdering of innocent civilians. If you take that as a statement for Hamas, you're the one conflating these two things and the problem is entirely in your head.

[yolovoe]

I highly recommend you read the book The Lemon Tree.

I used to think the same as you. Obviously, Palestinians are wrong, right? They rape and murder Israelis? Well, look < 100 years back, and "Israelis" did the same to Palestinians when they forced out Palestinians from their homes to make present-day Israel. Obviously, there was a lot going on in Europe at the time, so it's a bit hard to blame the "Israelis" from 1940s completely too.

Understanding how we got here tho is very important. It helps humanize Palestinians, understand why they're mad, and what we can do to peacefully move forward. I believe there is a peaceful solution to the almost 100 year long Israel/Palestine conflict, however unlikely it is to come to fruition.

[raxxorraxor]

Are you of the opinion that the attack on Israel was justified?

Btw. there is also a history before Israel even existed that would also be relevant here.

[yolovoe]

Of course not.

I am just saying we should understand why the attacks happened, and why many more like them will continue to happen for the next couple generations.