Hacker News new | ask | show | jobs
by up2isomorphism 812 days ago
13.4GB/s with 200x6 vcpus, gives 11MB/s per core, it is good but hard to say impressive.
2 comments

Building the inverted index is quite CPU-intensive, and we are also merging index files called "splits".
I never being able to understand why log indexing has to build inverted index. Decent columnar store with partitioning by date should be enough to quickly filter gigabytes of logs.
Because you want to find all occurrences of "error abc123" over the last year, immediately?
Quickwit co-founder here... I actually agree. For a few GBs, done right, columnar works fine AND is cost efficient.

After all, it does not matter much if a log search query answers in 300ms or 1s. However, there are use cases where a few GB just does not cut it.

The tale saying that you can always prune your dataset using timestamp and tags is simply not always valid.

Can you share your experience of when columnar fails?

It is possible to scan NVMe at a speed of multiple GB/sec, scans can be parallel and happen on multiple disks, over compressed data (10 Gb of logs ~ 1Gb to scan), data can be segmented and prefaced with Blum filters, to quickly check if a segment is worth scanning.

I'm not the person you asked, but say you have 10 TB of logs.

Assuming 3 GB/s SSD, 10 SSDs, and a compression as you suggested of 10x, a query for finding a string in the text would take 10000 / 3 / 10 / 10 = 33 seconds.

With an index, you can easily get it 100x faster, and that factor gets larger as your data grows.

In general it's just that O(log(n)) wins over O(n) when n gets large.

I didn't take your Bloom filter idea into consideration as it is not immediately obvious how a Bloom filter can support all filter operations that an index can. Also, the index gives you the exact position of the match, when the bloom filter only gives you existence, thus potentially still resulting in a large read amplication factor of a scan in the segment vs direct random access.

I’m thinking of how a data lake with parquet files can be structured. Each parquet file has header with summary statistics about the data, it has Blum filters too. A scanner would inspect files falling into the requested time range, for each file it would check headers, find ranges of data to scan. This is the theory, in which the scanner is not so much slower than index access while also allowing for efficient aggregations over log data.
What is your frame of reference?
Per-core store bandwidth is at least 14GB/s on Zen3, 35GB/s for non-temporal stores. Parsing JSON can be done at +2GB/s.

It's very healthy to take maximum bandwidth limits into consideration when reasoning about performance. For instance, for temporal stores, the bottlenecks you see are due to RAM latency and memory parallelism, because of the write-allocate. The load/store uarch can actually retire way more data from SIMD registers.

So there's already some headroom for CPU-bound tasks. For instance 11MB/s is very slow for JIT baseline compiler. But if your particular problem demands arbitrary random access that exceed L3 regularly, maybe that speed is justified.

What we do is CPU bound and we are not just parsing JSON here.

The largest work we do is building an inverted index. Oversimplified, it is equivalent to this:

  inverted_index = defaultdict(list)
  for (doc_id, doc_json) in enumerate(doc_jsons):
    c = json.loads(payload)
    for (field, field_text) in c.items():
      for (position, token) in enumerate():
        inverted_index[token].push((doc, position))
serialize_in_compressed_way_that_allows_lookup(inverted_index)

You can implement it in a couple of hours in the language of your choice to get a proper baseline.

I am sure we can still improve our indexing throughput... but I have never seen any search engine indexing as fast as tantivy.

If someone knows a project I should know of, I'd be genuinely keen on learning from it.

I'm curious, what is your frame of reference with regards to maximum speed of building inverted indices? Like, what is the maximum throughput you'd expect for this type of task, and what is your reasoning for it?