[sedivy94]

I agree with this wholeheartedly. The USA is a surveillance state and Apple’s security posture combined with its market share is a considerable hindrance. The arguments against anti-competitive and consumer-hostile mechanisms ad nauseam pale in comparison to this. I very much want to see real numbers, perhaps survey data, supporting the narrative that customers are locked in, unhappy with their experience, or otherwise underserved by Apple. Because IRL, I see nothing but happy customers.

[Foxhuls]

The majority of people I see complaining about apple’s walled garden ecosystem are people who are also proud to admit they don’t use apple products. It’s never made sense to me why people who don’t even use the products care so much about it. If people wanted to be able to do the things they claim they want to, they would switch to android but they don’t.

[skeaker]

I have never understood the inverse: Apple users defending their lack of features. Being able to send iMessages to your Android user friends or install software that you wrote without paying extra would only benefit you, yet you vehemently reject having the ability to do so for no apparent reason. "Security" is the word I see thrown around which doesn't make too much sense to me given that you can do all these things and be secure already on basically any desktop environment. What makes phones the special exception? Is phone architecture exceptionally insecure by default or something?

[Foxhuls]

You really think there’s no reason whatsoever? I have to believe that’s disingenuous. It’s just a phone to me and all I need is basic phone features to work. That’s also the reason I’m still using my iPhone X, it works as a phone and for basic tasks if I don’t want to get onto my computer or grab my laptop. I care more about my phone simply working than having additional features I don’t value. I don’t want to have to download multiple app stores in order to get specific apps. I already have to deal with that when it comes to epic on PC and it’s a pain in the ass. It also is going to make having to help the tech support for the technically challenged in my family so much more of a pain. There is a platform available if I want the features and capabilities you’re bringing up. I’m not telling anyone that their android is a bad choice or that it doesn’t work for them. Why do android users constantly seem to be telling me to be unhappy with the iPhone and that I need things I don’t want.

The only point that you’ve mentioned that can be annoying is sending a video to a friend with an android but it’s not a big enough of an issue that I care enough to do anything about it considering google photos and or an iCloud link is easy.

[skeaker]

> The only point that you’ve mentioned that can be annoying is sending a video to a friend with an android but it’s not a big enough of an issue that I care enough to do anything about it

...except defend Apple at every given opportunity when it would be just as easy to ask them to fix it so it wouldn't be as annoying, or even ignore the discussion altogether. That is the mentality I don't get. If it works for you, great. Clearly it doesn't work for others. Why go out of your way to tell them that their problems are invalid?

[Foxhuls]

What about it do you not get? I said it’s an inconvenience but not a huge issue. There are many ways of getting around it and iMessage only exists because of the way carriers used to charge for texting. I clearly said I wish it wasn’t the case but it’s just not impactful enough to me to really care about it. You’ll notice that most iPhone users don’t really care about the way android runs or works but a whole lot of android user seem to get really offended that iPhones aren’t androids and that iPhone users don’t care about that.

[skeaker]

But clearly there are plenty of iPhone users who do care to install their own software. One solid way to tell is that if there weren't then there wouldn't be an iOS homebrew scene. Is your point then is that because you personally don't care that nothing should improve? I just don't see why you would even enter this discussion if you don't care. What compels you to jump to Apple's defense by downplaying real issues and falsely claiming nobody who has an iPhone has them?

[dmitrygr]

> given that you can do all these things and be secure already on basically any desktop environment

My grandma had her bank account drained by a scammer who walked her through how to install a bank-looking app on her phone because android allows sideloading. I cannot fix my grandma. I can get her an iPhone.

"Oh, but computers...."

No. No scammer will walk her through apt-getting something that will mess with her bank account access in firefox on the ubuntu linux box we left her. Too many variations. Phones are easier targets as there are only two OSs.

[skeaker]

Sorry that happened to you. I have worked with a lot of elderly people in the past and it is always a shame when that happens to them. You are right that you can't really "fix" them. Even if you lock down iMessage and prevent sideloading, scammers will still send them to phishing pages in their browsers, or get them to read out a gift card over the phone. These methods are actually way, way more common than getting them to install a malicious sideloaded app. Ultimately I think Apple's anticompetitive tactics had no bearing on your grandmother being scammed.