[ImPostingOnHN]

The EU isn't forcing me or you to do anything.

The article elaborates on this point: There Is No Cookie Banner Law. Only bad website operators choosing to abuse their users with annoying consent dialogs.

Nobody in Europe is issuing "diktats", meaning citizen-supported legislation I guess, or affecting your business, unless you're trying to deal with their citizens' data. Just don't process EU citizen data and it's not an issue. Better yet, just don't track users.

In any case, your disagreement only serves to underscore that you were speaking on behalf of 1 person, not any country or countries. Otherwise, we wouldn't be disagreeing!

[FredPret]

I actually self-host all my web assets and use Matomo already. So I do actually agree with the premise.

What I object to strenuously is someone dictating terms to the world from distant shores, especially since they seem not to get how the internet works (it’s all funded by ads, online sales, and ads for online sales, all of which involve metrics and tracking!)

The diktats I mentioned include a ruling that Google Fonts are illegal now. So if I’m using those, or I’m using Google Analytics, and a European happens across my site, I’m now a criminal? Fuck that.

The consequences of contravening the GDPR are uncertain but sounds scary. This is terrible for the open and free internet.

[ImPostingOnHN]

Please tone down the hyperbolic rhetoric and FUD. Consider how strongly you can make your point without them.

To the point: Nobody in Europe is "dictating terms to the world", or "issuing diktats", meaning passing citizen-supported legislation I guess, or affecting your business, unless you're trying to deal with their citizens' data.

> The diktats I mentioned include a ruling that Google Fonts are illegal now. So if I’m using those, or I’m using Google Analytics, and a European happens across my site, I’m now a criminal?

No, because website operators have at least 4 more options:

1. Don't process EU citizen data (block them).

2. Don't track users, period (host the font on the site instead).

3. Don't track users until they log in (convert them).

4. Get users' informed consent (let them know that they'll be tracked on the site due to the choice of google fonts instead of hosting a font).

Wow, that wasn't scary at all! The general attitude I'm getting from some folks, though, is that they want to do anything they want to users without consequence and never change. This attitude is going lead to a lot of anguish. Others have rights, too, and they override our right to do whatever we want to them, in many cases.

[FredPret]

Here's the problem.

> 1. Don't process EU citizen data (block them).

Many webmasters have neither the time nor inclination to read up on EU law. So blocking is the easiest and safest solution to minimize our legal risks. This is absolutely terrible - I grew up dreaming of an internet that is really humanity's network; not islands separated by political allegiance.

I agree that I can tone it down, but 99.99% of the FUD around is directly the fault of the EU for not making it crystal clear what the theory and practice around their internet laws will be.

[ImPostingOnHN]

Luckily that's just 1 of the 4 options, and those 4 options are just 4 of many options, so no need to focus on 1 of many and say you don't like it: you can just choose another! Or you can choose to create the islands. I don't see what's so terrible about that.

Did website operators think they could keep violating the rights of EU citizens indefinitely? I mean, based on enforcement capacity, chances are most operators can, but it'd be good to stop. IMO, A network for humanity should prioritize humans and their rights, over tracking and ads, and the lack of respect for those rights is what I find terrible.

Real talk: if you have questions about the GDPR, ask them, and I'm sure the smart folks at HN will be able to help you find answers and overcome obstacles. You can build and not break laws, whether GDPR or ITAR, we can help. Nobody's saying it'll be zero work, but nobody's entitled to run a business doing whatever it wants with zero work, either, and shouldn't expect to.

[FredPret]

You keep missing my point, possibly on purpose, so I'll end this here.

The EU and the US and China disagree about what user rights are and what reasonable behaviour for a website is.

If one of those parties enforces their vision onto their traffic, it has a chilling effect - splittig the net into federations. By making GDPR super vague, the EU just makes everything worse, including for Europeans. If you disagree that the rules are vague, I'll refer you to the rest of this thread. Nobody knows what's being enforced or what the penalties are.

[ImPostingOnHN]

As far as the GDPR goes, only webmasters choosing to ban entire countries of users out of greed (wanting to unfairly profit off users) or laziness (not caring enough about the privacy of their users) or spite (punishing users because you don't like the GDPR) can achieve the splitting you describe. If it happens, it would be their decision, and thus their fault.

Real talk though, again: you say you personally feel the GDPR is vague. If you have questions about the GDPR, ask them, and I'm sure smart folks at HN will be able to help you find answers and overcome obstacles. You can build and not break laws, whether GDPR or ITAR, we can help. If you have troubles building, share them with us, let us advise you. Nobody's saying it'll be zero work, but nobody's entitled to run a business doing whatever it wants with zero work, either, and shouldn't expect to.