[chaostheory]

Despite all of the ceremony, Vietnam still hates China with good reason too. China keeps invading it including taking the islands in the South China Sea that Vietnam laid claim to. I believe the PLA actually attacked and killed Vietnamese troops stationed on those islands.

I’m also confident that the Philippines will now claim that China is the worst offender in the South China Sea.

As for any country involved in the 9 point line including Malaysia, anyone would have to be delusional to think that they support China stealing their territory

[FooBarWidget]

The point isn't that there are no animosities between SCS countries. It's that representing the situation as "evil China invades other countries" is one-sided, misleading, and ultimately harmful for peace. Having border disputes doesn't mean that countries must have bad relations, nor that they cannot be solved through peaceful means. Insisting on the notion that the existance of border conflicts must point to irredeemably evil intentions stands in the way of peacemaking because it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Of course, the powers that be want such a self-fulfilling prophecy, even if it's at the expense of south-east Asia, which is why they keep perpetuating this view.

[coupdejarnac]

China IS asserting control of territory claimed by other countries. Do you deny this? Whether or not China can justify their actions, other countries will be provoked.

Just face it, Xi is steering China towards another big leap backwards. All the foreign provocation is distracting from serious domestic issues.

[FooBarWidget]

Again, that is completely missing the point. The Malaysian minister just blasted this attitude last week. Every country around there is asserting control over every other's country's claims, and they all have overlapping claims. This isn't "China vs the rest", it's "everybody quarrels with everybody else" and thus it cannot be peacefully solved by one-sidedly focusing on just one party.

Malaysia and Indonesia responded to AUKUS with alarm, do you deny this?

[coupdejarnac]

I can't take your replies seriously.

[FooBarWidget]

You don't have to take my word for it. Try professor Kishore Mahbubani, ex-UN Security Council head, accomplished Singapore diplomat. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kg8TmKuaYAQ&t=2m48s

[chaostheory]

Breaking and continually flouting international law and the de facto naval boundaries accepted by literally every other country in the world is not a small thing. Until that unreasonable position changes, it is completely irredeemable. For the record, China is making the rest of South East Asia suffer here, and not the US. This is one of many reasons why Vietnamese and US relations are stronger than ever. China is the aggressor here. it’s delusional to say otherwise.

[FooBarWidget]

> This is one of many reasons why Vietnamese and US relations are stronger than ever.

Let's say that even this reading is heavily disputed. I don't think the Director of the Global South Program at the Quincy Institute, and member of the adjunct faculty at George Washington University, is as "delusional" as you think. https://responsiblestatecraft.org/biden-vietnam/

[chaostheory]

The 4 no’s doesn’t counter my point. Just because Vietnam won’t openly side with one nation doesn’t mean that Vietnam doesn’t hate China. It also doesn’t mean that they will not take steps to counter China. It will just be a more subtle response.

[FooBarWidget]

Whether Vietnam hates China or takes steps against China isn't even my point. Two things can be true at the same time: they can hate China, and it still isn't a simple "only China is at fault here and everyone wants to fight this evil" story. Whether Vietnam do or do not hate China, in no way invalidates my actual point that insisting on a one-sided manner is harmful rather than helpful for peace.