[vivekd]

This sounds like a race to the bottom where we keep demanding workers accept less and less to compete with poorer and poorer nations - while simultaneously ignoring that economic powerhouses like the US who pay workers relatively well

[ako]

Globalization is exactly that, until there’s global equality of salaries. We’re seeing it at the moment where Chinese cars are taking over the market because they’re better priced than European or American alternatives. To compete they have to move production to Chinese, see for example the large production of teslas in china, or they replace humans by robots…

The biggest problem with free markets is that it’s not really a sustainable system in the sense that with a certain income you can’t afford the things you need provided by people enjoying similar incomes. Hence we need to mass import product from lower income countries, and even local labor needs to be imported from lower income countries. Cleaners from low income countries, construction workers from low income countries.

[vivekd]

I don't buy that idea, an economy full of very poor people who can barely afford anything is not sustainable not at the national level and not at the global level.

Countries with very low wages are also countries with very low productivity (throwing cheap labour instead of technology and expertise at problems)

[ako]

Relationship between low wages and low productivity isn’t true, low wages are enabled by low costs of living. Cheaper employees can be more productive, and more expensive employees aren’t necessarily more productive. Or do you think every software engineer in SF is more productive than software engineers elsewhere?

[vivekd]

Maybe not all but for the most part yes I do think software engineers in San Francisco are by in large more productive than software engineers in Kansas city.

Just like I think finance professionals in NYC are more productive than finance guys elsewhere.

There's a culture around that in those places and opportunities and tools that promote excellence in those fields in a way that is very difficult for someone acting alone.

Just like it's very difficult for a kid in Africa to become a Olympic runner while there are many African American sprinters too, the tools and training and instruction and mentorship is simply not available, the opportunity is not there for him to be able to reach his potential. And that often matters more than innate ability

Workers in many poorer countries are overcoming comparatively more barriers just to work, while in rich countries we have systems set up to help us be as productive as possible