[boxed]

Creating your own app is actually pretty easy on iOS. I run an app on my phone right now that I built myself and that is not on the app store.

[the_gipsy]

It's not easy, you need a multithousand dollar apple machine, and you can't share this app with anybody else.

[JimDabell]

No, you don’t. You need a Mac, but you don’t need to buy one. You can use a free tier on a build service like Bitrise if you don’t have a Mac.

[the_gipsy]

Perhaps technically possible, but in practice it's against apple development directives. I doubt you do this yourself, or know anyone that actually develops iOS apps from a non-mac in the real world.

And you still can't share that app.

[Geisterde]

In practice no one cares what apples development directives are?

[JimDabell]

> in practice it's against apple development directives.

Most professional iOS developers use these kinds of services. They are totally commonplace and not against Apple’s terms in the slightest.

[themoonisachees]

MacOS TOS clearly state that if you're someone renting out access to macOS, you may only rent it for periods longer than 24h. I heavily doubt bitrise does that, as cost would be prohibitive (oh hey I wonder why that is)

[the_gipsy]

I feel you're being disingenuous. Close to zero professional iOS developers develop on a non-mac.

[Geisterde]

The post says you can run/develop what you want and get it to work on apple. Where do "professional" developers apply?

[JimDabell]

There isn’t a part of Apple’s terms where they say you are only allowed to use build servers if you are a professional iOS developer.

Build servers are absolutely fine.

[xandrius]

But don't you see how it is yet another hurdle?

Android builds work on that same mac too.

[JimDabell]

I didn’t say it wasn’t a hurdle, I said you don’t need a “multi thousand dollar Apple machine”. And the cheapest Macs cost way less than that anyway.

[boxed]

You can get a cheap used mac. You're just being silly now.

[ta8903]

Cheap for first world wages.

[boxed]

Not like PCs grow on trees.

This is getting silly.

[Timwi]

> Creating your own app is actually pretty easy on iOS.

I don't believe you. I believe that you probably left out some crucial detail, such as having to own a Mac first.

[boxed]

Well.. Yea. Sure. But saying "you cannot" is very different from "you need a mac".

[colonwqbang]

But this is exactly the kind of behaviour targeted by the DMA. Artificial restrictions in the functionality of iphone are inserted to drive sales of an unrelated product. It's page one of the Monopolist Playbook.

[tambourine_man]

Maintaining a developer toolkit for Windows and Linux is a major hurdle.

If they intentionally prevent a third party Xcode-compatible implementation from existing, that’s monopolistic behavior. If they don’t want to provide it themselves, it’s a rightful business choice and theirs to make, in my book.

[boxed]

I noticed that you moved the goalpost. Quite a bit. "Cannot" to "need a mac" is an enormous move.

If you think sales of macs are affected in a measurable way by the fact that xcode runs on it you are delusional.

[Timwi]

You didn't say “can”, you said “actually pretty easy”.

[ThatMedicIsASpy]

Is the $100 developer fee not required for own - non app store - apps?

[JimDabell]

No, you can deploy to your own device with a free Apple developer account. However there is a fairly short time line (I think a week?), after which you have to reinstall it. It’s designed for running apps on your device as you are developing them, not as a long-term deployment method.

[boxed]

Months. I have one on my phone that I haven't reinstalled for months. And I do this on my wife's phone, and let me tell you the wife acceptance factor of the app breaking after a week would be absolutely zero.

I don't know where you get these rumors from honestly.

[JimDabell]

With a free account?

I’ve heard many, many times that free accounts have a short expiry. I thought it was seven days, and I’ve just checked, and I remembered the duration correctly.

I can’t find an official source, but people mention this limit practically everywhere the topic is discussed. Here’s one reference, Google can help you find many, many more:

https://stackoverflow.com/a/73014888/8427

> Without Official Apple Dev Account

> If you don't have an official Apple Dev Account provisioning will only last for 1 week. The app will expire every 7 days (or less in some cases -- depending upon the day the initial certificate was created).

> With Official Apple Dev Account

> You will be able to provision your app for up to 1 year.

Can you create a provisioning profile with an expiry more than one week into the future with a free account?

[boxed]

Aha, yea ok. That's gotta be it. My bad. I do have paid account, since I have apps in the store and you have to pay that fee every year to keep that up (which is annoying for my free hobby apps!)

[dvngnt_]

installing it without Apple's blessing is the real problem