[LorenDB]

Maybe we should be pushing for fewer PWAs overall. I personally will not use any web-based app when I can use a native app (with a few exceptions). PWAs just add unnecessary bloat, and the current HTML/CSS/JS stack that the web uses was designed for delivering text documents, not apps, so that inherently limits the experience.

[deergomoo]

I’m 50/50 on this: if I care about something enough to install it rather than going to a website, I’ll take a half decent native app over a PWA any day, even without the gimping on Apple’s part. Truly native anyway; I have a strong dislike for stuff like Flutter both conceptually and in practice.

But I also consider Apple’s iron grip on the platform to be against the spirit of computing, and I think having a viable alternative is important. I think there is a segment of software that would benefit from a nice PWA, but where two native apps would not really be worth anyone’s time.

[palata]

> But I also consider Apple’s iron grip on the platform to be against the spirit of computing

But the problem here is the App Store, right? Both native iOS apps and PWAs need access to the hardware, which is provided by Apple.

Really my understanding is that people push hard for PWAs either because they want to work around the App Store, or because they are web dev (and every dev tends to be imperialist with their favourite language, that's not only a web thing).

[sccxy]

People just like the open web. PWAs are part of the open web.

It's not so fun when Apple decides to change the app store rules and now your app is banned forever.

There is no guarantee that your app won't disappear from the App Store tomorrow.

[palata]

> People just like the open web. PWAs are part of the open web.

"Open" is relative in this context: I can't just go merge any code I want into Chromium so that I can distribute my cool app with my very custom feature to all the Chromium users, can I?

Because some people like PWAs (and what they represent) does not mean that private companies should be forced to support them.

> There is no guarantee that your app won't disappear from the App Store tomorrow.

That is completely different debate, unrelated to PWAs, right?

[mvdtnz]

I personally will not use any native app when I can use a web app

[theshackleford]

I personally will not use any web app when I can use a native app.

[andix]

Let me tell you a secret: a LOT of native apps are built on web technologies. Those apps are just shells with some web views.

[LorenDB]

That's why I avoid Electron software when possible. I use nheko instead of Element for my Matrix client, avoid VSCode unless I really need it, and shun Discord when possible.

[andix]

I'm not talking about Electron software, Electron doesn't exist on iOS or Android.

Android and iOS have integrated webview componentes that are much more lightweight and are used in a lot of "native apps". Very often you will never notice if you don't look at the source code.

[msie]

Im always refreshing my pwa because not all resources get loaded or some js fails to run.