[nucleardog]

> Like I want light switches that match my server state for my lights. If I change the switch via my phone, I want the switches to change as well so that the physical switch is always the true state of the light.

Like it's an absolute requirement that they show a different physical position when on or off?

I've got some relatively cheap z-wave switches. They're only momentary, but up is on and down is off. When they're off, I have them configured to show a small white light on the bottom. So my indication of switch state is "small light = off, big light in the middle of the ceiling = on".

The switches _can't_ be out of sync with their state because they are directly controlling the attached lights. If anything were to somehow get out of sync, it would be home assistant.

[gregmac]

Yeah, same here. I just don't see the need for a "mechanical indicator" like the OP seems to be asking for, because you can tell by the state of the room.

Mechanical switches aren't even reliable for this because of how 3-way switches work (their state doesn't indicate the state of the light). Unless you remember which are 3-way and which are single, you can't trust any of them. With smart switches in the same locations this is a non-issue.

An interesting thing is switches where you can't see if they're on as easily, such as the outside front lights, are for the most part fully automated (based on timer/door/motion and/or camera object detection) and we basically never touch the switch at all.

It's important to be consistent, though, since you technically can program the switches to do anything. In my house pressing up once turns the light on as you'd expect, but in some rooms the light will be less than 100% or have a warmer color temperature at night. Pressing twice turns on max brightness (or something similar, such as: 5000K color temp; also turning on the lights an adjacent room; turning on _all_ the backyard lights). I rarely use 3, 4 or 5-taps except for a couple special things (eg: 4x off on my office switch puts my PC to sleep; 3x on one of the basement switches activates a "party mode" my kid loves).

[andsoitis]

> Yeah, same here. I just don't see the need for a "mechanical indicator" like the OP seems to be asking for, because you can tell by the state of the room.

It is an aesthetic concern. If you have two light switches next to each other, they can get out if sync by being in different positions but representing the same state (light on or off).

That would be very ugly.

[nucleardog]

> If you have two light switches next to each other, they can get out if sync by being in different positions but representing the same state (light on or off).

I have some of these:

https://www.thesmartesthouse.com/collections/800-series-z-wa...

(Third photo shows a side view.)

They can't be in different physical positions. They're momentary switches. When you press it up then release, it goes back to centered. The only indication of state on the switch is the (configurable/optional) little LED at the bottom of the switch. I have mine set so it's white if the switch is off (helps you find it in the dark), and off when the switch is on.

So if you have any 3-way switches in your house (I do!), it's actually an improvement as far as your concerns.

[karlshea]

I think people are asking why he needs a mechanical indicator because there are a bunch of switches available now that don't have one but also don't really look out of place.

[Symbiote]

My apartment has stateless switches for the radio controlled lights. (I don't know the details of the system.)

I've lived there for over 5 years, and I still regularly press the wrong switch where there are two or three next to each other.

[jgalt212]

True. If you have a 3-way switch next to a 2-way switch, you get the same confusion.

[thunfischbrot]

I solved this by using "Push-Button Switches": https://katalog.gira.de/en/datenblatt.html?ean=4010337126034...

They look like a push-button, are therefore always "aligned", though the electrical switch alternates between open and closed.

[thinkmassive]

Have you ever used a three-way light switch?

Plus the momentary switches are always centered, they look fine next to traditional switches in either position.

[euroderf]

> some relatively cheap z-wave switches. They're only momentary, but up is on and down is off. When they're off, I have them configured to show a small white light on the bottom.

This sounds great. Can you provide a pointer or full search term to getting these ?

[thebasic]

As others have said - I set up my whole house with Zooz z-wave switches (mostly ZEN72 and ZEN77) a couple years back. Very solid - started out on SmartThings, now on Home Assistant. I think my average cost was about ~$22/switch, cheaper than many alternatives. By default they show a small green light when the light is off, but it can be customized to different colors, or off all together. Loving my decision more and more as I keep seeing more news about issues with cloud connected devices and companies.

[michaelmior]

The Inovelli Red series is a popular choice for Z-Wave switches. They also make a Zigbee version with similar features. Personally, I have been using Lutron Caseta switches which use a proprietary protocol, but you can get local control and they've been incredibly solid.

[lsaferite]

Over the years, every time I've looked at the Inovelli switches they are always out of stock. I really wanted to switch to them but could never make it happen. If they've solved their stock issues, that's good to hear.

[michaelmior]

I don't think they have unfortunately which is one of the reasons I'm using the Caseta switches. I would love to switch myself too since the price point is similar, they use an open standard, and the controllable LED is a just a cool added feature.

[twisteriffic]

The range and battery life on the remotes is unbelievable as well.

[nucleardog]

A good chunk of my z-wave hardware is from Zooz. I haven't tried any other brands, so I can't really compare or provide a solid "this is better" recommendation or anything. Mine are the older 700 series.

I've got a mix of the "Zooz ZEN71" for places where I need to switch larger loads (e.g., bathroom light and fan, all my outdoor lights) and the "Zooz ZEN72" elsewhere as it supports dimming.

[windexh8er]

Zwave Light Switch

[makapuf]

None of my lamps have a set position for on or off since they're on a toggle switch.