[andrewoneone]

Totally agree. The modularity and the amount of “batteries included” can eventually become a negative. The last thing I want is for someone to reinvent RxJava yet it seems to happen in every one of the more bloated frameworks. “Are you familiar with reactive programming? Oh cool - but are you familiar with mixing RxJava and Spring’s reactor? That’s what we now have and it’s a real treat sometimes.” This is just one sad and possibly poorly outdated example as I haven’t worked with spring in some years now.

[michaelcampbell]

I worked in a place using Django, with dozens of additional plugins and enhancements.

And my PR's were routinely flagged for writing 3-5 lines of idiomatic python that any python programmer (indeed, any PROGRAMMER) would have understood instead of spending half a day to try and find the "Django way" (or worse, the "whatever 5000 line plugin we installed to save the programmer from having to repeat 2 lines of idiomatic python 10-12 times") way to do it.

Their (IMO insane) adherence to the common, but misunderstood idea of DRY was insanely unproductive.

These frameworks become "languages" in themselves, and unless you're in it all day every day, it's _harder_ to get things done due to their incredibly large attack surface.

[ahmedfromtunis]

Can you give an example of this "Django way" code vs pythonic code dichotomy?

I'm very curious to see how that may look like. I've been using Django for years now and was never faced with such choice.

[michaelcampbell]

It was over 3 years ago so sadly I can't. If I recall correctly a number of things I was forced to put into some sort of serializer. I'm also trying to remember what the plugin/enhancement was involved; "Django Rest", maybe?