[jijijijij]

Personally, I found the smartphone app and web experience to be waaaaaaay more addictive than desktop browsing, because the phone is always with me.

I also found I can break away from my phone, when I delete and disable all content streams. This painfully includes podcasts and Spotify, at least initially, and I also disabled Safari all together! Otherwise it won't break the habit of reaching for your phone! Screen time limitations for apps won't do, because I am still not getting the tease out of my mind.

The idea is to have the phone for communication with contacts, do-one-thing tools, navigation and personal time and information management. And nothing else. The phone should never be the place where "something happens", where you can discover and explore. It shouldn't be more on your mind than your headphones, not more exciting than a spoon. Notifications should always ever be sent either by "myself" (e.g. calendar) or by real contacts (calls and messages).

Public transport planning/navigation, synchronized calendars and encrypted messaging are the deal breakers with "stupid phones"/no phone, for me.

Sure you can still shift your pleasure seeking to the desktop, but at least your mind won't be bothered by temptation and intrusive thoughts, when you're on a walk, sitting in the bus, in the kitchen, on the toilette, ... You will have a chance to break away.

For desktop web, maybe ublock the 'next' button on websites like HN? Hide all the internet points?

[esperent]

> This painfully includes podcasts and Spotify, at least initially, and I also disabled Safari all together!

I've done the same on Android since about six months ago. No browser, no play store, no social media apps. It's frustratingly hard and technical to remove these, and it shouldn't be. No problem for anyone here I am sure, but most people would find it too hard and give up.

Next I noted what still kept my attention on the phone and removed everything it all. My email client, ChatGPT app, all the games like solitaire. They all went.

It's great. I still spend time on HN, Reddit, and Facebook, but much, much less. And as soon as I leave my home office, I'm disconnected from all of it. I am pretty sure I will never go back.

I've replaced it with my ereader and a note taking app on my phone. Most of it went totally unnoticed and painlessly, the biggest cognitive issue I noticed has been my desire to research things when I am out and about. But I use the notes app to keep a list of things, and then I research them more fully and mindfully when I'm at my laptop.

Note that I definitely do spend more time on these websites on my laptop than I would have before. But the overall time I spend is way down, and that's good enough for now.

[Erratic6576]

I beg you to please tell me how to uninstall a web browser altogether. I was dreaming of installing GrapheneOS but nobody in the forums was able to answer my question whether it was possible to uninstall the web browser altogether in a way that renders it impossible to be installed again in a whim.

I struggled to have a pixel delivered, for the 6th time, so I ended up with an iPhone, which has screen time.

My wife despises me when I ask her to manage screen lock codes for me, so I’ll ask a kind coworker I always meet on Tuesdays, to lock the screen time in my stead.

Were that to fail, I’m kind of doomed. I ducking spent around 12 hours yesterday scrolling between NH, Reddit, messaging, and other webs.

Another option is to get a signal capable feature phone, but those are also smartphones and quite expensive and outdated. For me, it’s either screen-time lock or grapheneOS without a web browser.

I know I’m missing on the good HN content but it’s still way too engaging.

I’d only allow “nautilus” and r/science and a few other websites whose engagement-interest ratio is higher

[jijijijij]

> I ended up with an iPhone, which has screen time.

You can also disable Safari through content restrictions, which is protected by the PIN, too.

By the way, I set up the restrictions and then blindly type the PIN, so I can't remember myself. May need some tries to get in a PIN twice :D Alternatively, you could try to hold the phone sideways and use a mirror, do something else immediately afterwards.

Nobody needs to know the PIN. You fall back to your Apple ID anyway. With your ID you can set up a proper, long, long password you can hide on paper, in the attic or something. If you wanna go hardcore, you could also split the password in three long parts without noting the order. Then you'd may have to try all 6 combinations which is rather annoying. And you can have the Appstore require a password for installations too.

Usually it's enough to delay the immediate impulse long enough for your better self to gain control again :)

I would really recommend not to restrict (just) screen time. Complicated schedules will only encourage you to have legitimate reason lifting restrictions, and even low supply won't get the phone out of your mind. Phone: No fun - 24/7.

You don't need a schedule to not look at the dial pad :D

[jijijijij]

I am happy it's working for you! The key really is to make the phone holistically boring. Like, the first few times you mindlessly reach for it out of habit, when you remember there is nothing (!) for you to do, you need to feel a very sobering disappointment. That's the feeling to aim for. Sadly music is a casualty. (If anyone really needs a personal soundtrack, maybe consider local files and VLC?)

Also, whenever I am tempted to reinstall the suck, for whatever "important" or "exceptional" reason, I try to ask myself "Is it important enough to risk messing up your life? Is it really important to do this instant?", or "Is avoiding these unexpected five hours of idle boredom worth reinforcing the toxic habit, enslaving your mind again, adding to the tragic loss of lifetime?".

In regard to "research", removing all web browsing is an easier sell, if you can still look up the odd, timely (actually) important information somewhere. I keep Kiwix (for Wiktionary and Wikipedia*), Dict.cc and the Google Maps app around. Google Maps usually has more, and more up-to-date POI information, and better search results, than Apple Maps. E.g. you can find a doctor's phone number, or a store's opening hours, reliably. This covers 95% of my "look up" impulses and the remaining 5% are better done on a larger screen and with a keyboard anyway, so they get postponed to a note or reminder, same as you do. (I rarely do follow ups later, go figure...)

I guess mail and messaging really depends on your use case and social sphere. At least, I need to send emails from my phone sometimes (if only to get it done immediately).

> Note that I definitely do spend more time on these websites on my laptop than I would have before.

Yes, but it's much less reinforcing and invasive. And on the desktop you can modify those streams to tingle your dopamine receptors less. Like mentioned, ublock-ing the 'next' button, or 'related/suggested content', internet points, and so on.

---

* Yes, without the suck "content" cached, I got space for offline wikis lol...

[esperent]

> Like, the first few times you mindlessly reach for it out of habit, when you remember there is nothing (!) for you to do, you need to feel a very sobering disappointment. That's the feeling to aim for

Yes exactly! I feel like we need to start a movement here.

I did try Kiwix, but honestly I don't need any reference material on my phone unless I'm going on vacation or something. In which case I almost certainly need a browser for the trip, and that's fine.

[jijijijij]

> I feel like we need to start a movement here.

Feedicts Anonymous? Refreshotics Anonymous? ESC F5?

I guess, not the best idea to organize online :D So...

Each one, teach one?