[atourgates]

One of the things I have trouble understanding is why "rural mountain towns near large population centers" are exploding in the West, but not the East.

I understand some of the issues. The mountains are smaller and the snow isn't nearly as consistent.

But still. It seems like a ski resort 3.5 hours from Boston should be absolutely brimming with customers every long weekend.

On the other hand, I sat in a hot tub with a New Yorker at a Salt Lake City ski resort who claimed that it was quicker and easier for him to get there, than to Vermont ski hills.

I don't think the math quite adds up (The drive from NYC to Jay is going to be 6.5 hours, but you could fly from JFK to Burlington in 1hr 20min, and drive another 1hr 20min to Jay, vs a 4hr flight and 1hr drive to Park City, UT) - but I get the point.

[meandthewallaby]

I'm a fellow Kingdom resident -- there are plenty of ski hills between here and Boston. The ones closer get more play. Stowe is a bigger resort, and it gets more play. Less so between here and Montreal, but there's ski hills north of Montreal that are closer. A place like Littleton, just beyond Cannon Mountain, _is_ brimming with customers every long weekend. Jay (and Burke, which is _really_ a locals' mountain) are very much in the in-between.

[ghaff]

In spite of doing a reasonable bit of downhill skiing at one point out of the Boston area, I have never been to Jay and have only been to Burke because a Dartmouth professor I knew was I think on the board and his son had gone to Burke Mountain Academy.

Stowe was about my journey limit for a weekend and I was in a ski condo after graduation from grad school around Killington for 5 years or so. (Combination of New Yorkers and people in the Boston area.) Jay and Burke were always pretty much out of my range.

[iamthepieman]

This is happening at the big Vermont ski resorts like Stowe and Killington. Stowe might as well be a suburb of Boston, New York and Quebec.

No one around here can figure it out either. I sit next to a guy at my coworking space who works on rural economic development. Just today he was putting together a report on some funding that was given to promote small businesses. He said they were supposed to present the report to the board but the program had done so poorly that they were just going to file the report and never bring it up again.

[scythe]

The better ski resorts in the Northeast — Killington, Sugarloaf — aren't as close to the big cities. NH is sort of an exception. But in general, you can drive there on Friday, ski on the weekend, and drive home on Sunday, or you can't. Six hours is just over the line.

There are also more ski resorts in the East. After the environmental movement really kicked off in the '70s it became a lot harder to open a new ski hill with a Forest Service permit. There are no ski resorts in the Rose Mountains or the Wallowas, regions of the West with huge vertical drops and high snowfall. They're protected wilderness. (Today the nearby towns are much poorer than Vail.) Competition keeps prices down.

And the smaller ski resorts in the West aren't exactly driving local economies. Leadville and Lakeshore are just muddling through. It's a very winner-take-all market.

[resters]

Vermont skiing is better than nothing, but it's absolutely not comparable to what is available in the western US.

[vulgardream]

I think there’s an underestimation of the impact that mega-passes (e.g., Ikon, Epic, and Mountain Collective) have on non-local skier traffic at resorts. A lot of Vermont resorts are crowded with “flat landers” aka Boston, New Jersey, or New Yorkers on weekends; however these tend to be resorts on multi-mountain passes like Killington, Sugarbush, Stowe, Okemo, etc. These resorts and towns aren’t hurting because they draw in outsiders and casual skiers who stay in hotels or condos and spend money at bars, restaurants and other local businesses. In my experience Jay attracts locals, Canadians from southern Quebec, and a few die hard skiers. Most of these are day trippers or stay on resort and are not spending lots of money in the limited establishments that surround Jay. Passes also make travel to a west coast or European resort more feasible financially and logistically. The cost of skiing is already accounted for you just need to find reasonable flights and accommodations for 7-10 days and you have already broken even on the pass.

[mp05]

> One of the things I have trouble understanding is why "rural mountain towns near large population centers" are exploding in the West, but not the East.

The skiing sucks? Never skied out east, but I understand it's basically ice skating. But that's hearsay.

[speed_spread]

There's a reason it's called the /r/icecoast. These mountains are all terrible, all the time, especially after a snowstorm and especially Jay Peak. Never go there and tell your friends to stay away.

[ghaff]

There can be a lot of ice and hard-pack; sure it's not getting any better.

Don't know how true the generalization is but, while some people have condos for the weekend in New England, you tend to live nearer a major metro center and go up for 2 or 3 day weekends.

Out West, I imagine it's more common for people to just move to one of the larger ski towns--or at least to get a second home there for their recreational season of choice. At least, that's the very anecdotal impression I get. If I wanted a season pass and had a lot of free winter time to spend downhill skiing, I'd probably do it out West. New England is more accessible for multi-season activities but the locations are probably also more accessible for weekends and long weekends.

[notatoad]

the skiing is fine.

not great, but most of the people going out to utah for a ski weekend are on manmade snow on blue groomers, and the blue groomers out east are just as good as the blue groomers in the west.

[RandallBrown]

> the blue groomers out east are just as good as the blue groomers in the west

The blue groomers out west are about twice as long and usually a lot less icy.

[mp05]

I don't disagree with the latter part, but if I planned a weekend in the Rockies and skied groomers the whole time, something went wrong.

[PaulHoule]

On a good day it is great to ski out east (particularly spring conditions) but it is not always a good day. An alumni club I am in is thinking about scheduling a ski trip to the local ski area in the next few weekends, it is 30 min away or so and only $65 but conditions might be terrible.

[ghaff]

>It seems like a ski resort 3.5 hours from Boston should be absolutely brimming with customers every long weekend.

They at least used to be. Probably still are but those are basically the mountains near route 93 in NH. NYC was more inclined to hit Vt. peaks like Stratton and Killington. (Stowe too but longer drive.)

There's more overhead with hopping on a plane but, as I wrote elsewhere, I tended to switch from weekends/long weekends in New England to weeks out West where the snow was (usually) a lot better. And SLC is unusually easy to get to the mountains from.

[15457345234]

> One of the things I have trouble understanding is why "rural mountain towns near large population centers" are exploding in the West, but not the East.

West coast tech types have all gone nuts, believe they're Ernst Stavro Blofeld and think they need to build secret mountain lairs. Either that or nuclear lifeboats. (Different symptoms of the same disease.)

[lumost]

Jay peak is more of a six hour drive. SLC would be a 3-4 hour flight. You can get from downtown Boston to the airport in 10 minutes.

[ghaff]

Yeah but the total travel time is still longer, especially if you don't live in the core urban area. That said, latterly I mostly gave up on weekend New England trips and went to generally Utah for a week.

[boringg]

I don't know .. go look at Mont Tremblant its completely overrun with people.