[makerdiety]

> All engineers are expected to have some requisite level of knowledge and skill. Only in software do we accept engineers having the absolute bare minimum knowledge and skill to complete their specific job.

If that was true, then there would be opportunities for entry into professional software engineering careers. Because the only opportunities there are for software engineering jobs are opportunities for "senior" software engineers. Which entails much more than the absolute bare minimum knowledge and skill.

So there's some inconsistency going on within the mindset of people who measure competence and fitness in engineering, in the broadest sense of the concept of engineering.

Maybe engineering itself, then, isn't even remotely the noble profession it is widely believed to be? Maybe engineers and even scientists aren't that really intelligent? Or intelligent at all? Maybe science and mathematics should be abandoned in favor of more promising pursuits?

[salawat]

Engineering as applied to software is completely watered down in practice compared to Professional Engineering as implemented by many states.

If a software engineer "signs off" on software design, they have no personal or professional liability in the eyes of the law, or anywhere near the same expectations and professional/ethical oversight that comes with the territory of being a PE.

Until a "Software Engineer" can basically look a company in the face and deny a permit to implement or operate a particular stack/implementation, this will not change.

And yes, I am fully aware that this software engineer would basically become an "approver of valid automated business process implementations". This would also essentially be a social engineering exploitable position for implementing nepotistic dominion over a business jurisdiction. Hence why I'm not sure it is even a desirable path to go down.

[makerdiety]

> Until a "Software Engineer" can basically look a company in the face and deny a permit to implement or operate a particular stack/implementation, this will not change.

The possibility of a business not earning revenue or income as a result of its software development attempt is a form of software authorization that prefers "good" coding over "bad" coding. Whatever the global industrialist landscape decides is good and bad.

And, interestingly, earning income with software development is a much harder hazing ritual than the paths of traditional academia.

[safaaaaajdn]

There are plenty of entry level software roles out there. They are often listed as senior and may not align with your particular definition of entry level, but there are definitely people that are getting those jobs who have limited prior professional experience.