[ChainOfFools]

> abstraction stops being relevant

I found this to be the points where abstractions being learned today are only precursors for abstractions that will be learned tomorrow. Another way to put it is at the stage where you're learning to make tools that are themselves only used to make other tools, not used to get results outside of the domain of tool making.

These stages have no apparent relevance outside of math, and if your style of memory formation depends on making many inferential links to laterally associated concepts, moreso than making a few direct links between vertically associated concepts, it can be rough going. A lot of what feels like following memorized pirate treasure map directions in the dark, with no sense of what obstacles you're working around or even the general direction where the treasure lies to give you a sense of bearing and progress.

[galaxyLogic]

I remember memorizing multiplication tables in school.

I learned that 3 x 9 = 27. You just had to memorize that, right? Well then I realized that if 3 x 10 = 30, then 3 x 9 must be one fewer '3' added together by the multiplication, which means take out one '3' from the set of 3s you are adding together by multiplication when doing 3 x 10, which comes to 30 - 3 = 27.

That means I didn't really need to memorize 3 x 9, I needed the above simple rule in addition to the fact that n x 10 is always what you get when you take the digit 'n' and add a 0 after it.

So learning multiplication tables was hard, until I learned the rule of looking for an easier-to-remember result and then adding or subtracting something to it. Of course I also had to understand that multiplication is really just repeated addition.

My teacher never taught me this trick, just told us to recite the multiplication tables in out heads again and again. But after doing that for some time I figured out the above trick myself.

Learning math beyond multiplication is hard if you cannot multiply numbers in your head, because lots of math presentations assume that of course you know that 3 x 9 = 27. Or something similar. It is not just about understanding the concepts, it's about being able to perform calculations, in your head. Else you cannot understand the explanations of new concepts. Even though we have pocket-calculators, we still need to be able to do calculations in our heads to understand new topics. in math.

So, learning what is 3 x 9 is not hard AFTER you have learned n * 10, and this trick. I assume something like that happens in the minds of mathematicians. They know a lot of math already which makes it easier to understand new results when they already know a lot. To learn what is n * 10, you had to learn 1 x 10, 2 x 10, 3 x 10 etc. and then understand the pattern in there.

Learning something is easy if you already know lots of related stuff. So it's not about learning more and more difficult things, it is about just learning more and more, related things. It is about having more and more (learned) data in your head.

I assume that is also why LLMs work so well: They have lots of data.

In summary: Learning math is not "difficult", it is tedious.

[mlyle]

> So, learning what is 3 x 9 is not hard AFTER you have learned n * 10, and this trick.

The tricky thing here is that you have a limited amount of working memory, energy, and focus.

To do well at math you need:

- practice at being focused and confronting things that are hard

- an understanding of the problem space you are facing and how your tools work

- enough stuff memorized so that you don't have to context switch too much

You can have some missing pieces in the third area and do okay. But for a lot of students, needing to context switch to do simple arithmetic throws them off. I encounter students who can do any step of a problem, and can even describe the steps of what to do, but when I observe them thunk down to arithmetic and struggle, they aren't able to find their place again and make mistakes.

Most students are better served by getting their multiplication tables firmly committed to memory; perhaps a mnemonic or a simple algorithm of multiplying by 9 helps them get there. But you still don't want to be leaning on that when you're trying to factor a quadratic or cancel things in fractions or whatever.

(Seeing patterns, and learning why the pattern works is perhaps more valuable than multiplication tables... but that doesn't mean you don't need the multiplication tables.)

[galaxyLogic]

Good point about working memory. And you are right if it is in memory you can read stuff that assumes you know it and just glide through without stopping.

For me the tricks like above were like a backup solution, using it a few times it became obvious that 9 x 3 == 27. Indelible. It is. For some cases it was like "It can only be 27 OR 26" and then I would use the trick figure out which.

But whether you use a simple trick and a trivial calculation or don't have to do that at all the point is the same it should not take much thinking which would cause you to lose your focus and train-of-thought, as you say.