[johnnyworker]

> There is not some kind of "war" package with shared responsibility. That is sophistry to sweep actual war crimes done by actual people under the rug.

I'd say that's simply accurate, and should be said more often, not less.

[tptacek]

Right, but you didn't simply say it; you said it emotively and with implications about good faith from the other side. It's your call, I'm not the boss of you, but I think you two are probably wasting your time at this point. 7 days! That's a very old thread.

[johnnyworker]

If someone ignores what I say over and over and over again, no matter how I rephrase the point I was making all along, I no longer assume good faith, no. The goal at that point isn't to convince them, but to end it without letting the last word be another falsehood. Seems that last comment did the trick, so.