[danpla]

I didn't use RemedyBG or Tracy, but I did try ImHex (https://github.com/WerWolv/ImHex) and it loaded 12% of the CPU because everything is being repainted 60 times per second. Heck, it even has an option to limit the FPS, which solves the CPU load a bit, but at the same time results in sluggish input because the event handling is tied to the drawing frequency.

So yes, the experience was not good, and I don't see what these tools would lose by using a proper GUI. I don't want every utility to drain my laptop battery like a decent video game.

ImGui is great if you already have a loop where everything is unconditionally redrawn every frame, but otherwise it's a really odd choice for an end-user application.

[ocornut]

> it even has an option to limit the FPS, which solves the CPU load a bit, but at the same time results in sluggish input because the event handling is tied to the drawing frequency.

It seems like an issue of how it is implemented. I think Tracy does it well. It's party my fault since Dear ImGui lib and backends currently doesn't have an "official" way to tackle this, so everyone does their own sauce and it's easy to make a mistake. But I have zero doubt it is doable.

> I don't see what these tools would lose by using a proper GUI.

What they would lose is that they wouldn't exist in the first place or wouldn't be as full-featured. I'm surprised this is so hard to comprehend? In spite of its shortcomings, software like Dear ImGui is an enabler to make things exists and happen.

[danpla]

> What they would lose is that they wouldn't exist in the first place or wouldn't be as full-featured.

These are some pretty bold statements.

* "They wouldn't exist in the first place" implies that ImGui was the primary reason and foundation for creating these programs. As if using the traditional retained mode GUI is so unbearable that without ImGui the authors would have abandoned the idea of creating these tools in the first place.

* "Or wouldn't be as full-featured" implies that ImGui is either more full-featured or (if you meant time) is faster to develop with compared to a traditional retained mode GUI.

> I'm surprised this is so hard to comprehend?

Well, I'm surprised that some people keep presenting the immediate mode GUI as the silver-bullet alternative to the traditional GUI. Don't get me wrong: I understand that IMGUI is a great tool if you need to quickly add a throway GUI to a game, but otherwise there is a price to pay, both by the developer and the end user.

[ocornut]

I am not saying it is a silver bullet.

I'm saying it is making some development - those that are well aligned with the frameworks qualities - particularly efficient. Efficiency and productivity are everything. Productivity is often a major contributor in bridging the gap between cancelled and released, between painful and pleasant, between under-featured and full-featured, between abandoned and maintained, between unprofitable and profitable.

So while not saying things are simple to describe and compare, they are not, Dear ImGui focus on high-productivity is the reason why it has been adopted by some people.

> without ImGui the authors would have abandoned the idea of creating these tools in the first place.

It is probable those particular authors would have, yes.

I meant, it's not a secret that many engineers are totally afraid or uninterested in UI programmers. A common feedback is of certain people saying "hey, dear imgui made UI programming fun for me". So I'm confidently saying that SOME software wouldn't have existed without dear imgui. It being so brutally different in term of philosophy, coding style, culture, by definition makes it reach a different crowd.

> implies that ImGui is either more full-featured or (if you meant time) is faster to develop with compared to a traditional retained mode GUI.

Dear ImGui is clearly LESS full-featured than e.g Qt, but for some uses is is faster to develop with than most other frameworks.