[zvrba]

Same here. Even though the "new" Dune has a lot of good VFX, I found it boring to watch, and that was only Part I. Before watching "new", I watched Lynch's to have something to compare to. I vastly prefer Lynch's Dune. It wasn't boring. He managed to cram the whole story in less than 2h30 and in (to me) coherent and understandable way. Although the movie did demand all of my attention and weaving of threads in my mind while watching. Lynch still wins, hands down, not the least because of the atmosphere.

[ethbr1]

> [Lynch] managed to cram the whole story in less than 2h30 and in (to me) coherent and understandable way.

I don't think you can make a coherent and understandable movie-Dune without using voice-over character thoughts. You need the footnotes.

It's a tricky device, because it's so easy to overuse, but Lynch mostly limits himself to where it's really needed. AND makes it play better with his trademark dreamlike mood.

Villeneuve's Dune is what you get without this -- I hope everyone read the books! Which on one hand, respect your audience. But on the other, most people haven't read the books.

E.g. Lynch Gom Jabbar: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QrCfivcQe48

Villeneuve Gom Jabbar: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mbTp1vlRqYA

PS: Wtf Lady Jessica in Villeneuve Pt I? She's got enough mettle to defy the Reverend Mother and bear a male child, but then all that strength disappears? I get it... setting up for contrast with Fremen Jessica, but hamfisted. :(

[bitzun]

Several women have told me they thought Lady Jessica was a strong female character in Dune pt 1 after I complained that she was more abject/emotional than in the book. It felt like we had watched a different movie, but it sounds like I'm just wrong.

[wharvle]

My wife hates when media codes feminine as weak, as in pointedly avoiding ever displaying a strong female character being upset. Her perception is that a lot of media (and usually pieces trying to be extra-feminist) communicate “women can be strong… if they get more masculine” rather than “feminine can be strong”.

That may be the kind of thing you’re seeing: not everyone may see “she privately struggles with difficult emotional experiences, and doesn’t bottle that up, but perseveres and kicks ass anyway” as weakness.

[rainonmoon]

I broadly agree with that sentiment and have often struggled with that same concept in media. However in the books, Jessica not only heavily portrays lots of traits typically considered feminine, but her stoicism is one of them. Dune is a hard book to adapt; so much of the characterisation happens via internal monologues that are necessary to contextualise a lack of externalised reaction (everyone is putting on airs the whole time, basically.) But Jessica's Bene Gesserit emotional control is a clear parallel with the way women are often forced to sublimate emotion in every facet of society in order to be taken as seriously as their male counterparts. I re-read the first three books a few weeks ago and was absolutely dumbstruck by how Herbert's Bene Gesserit and Jessica as well could've been an artefact from this decade, not six decades ago. It's still a salient representation of gender roles half a century later. I liked the most recent Dune just fine, and I adore Rebecca Ferguson is just about everything, but this change to her character really bothered me for that.

[wharvle]

Yeah, that makes sense. A certain edge to that theme of the book did get dulled by that compromise made in the adaptation, I see what you mean.

[hutzlibu]

"But on the other, most people haven't read the books."

People still enjoyed it, though.

I read the books after the movie and yes, there is so much more to the whole world, but apperently other people enjoyed it without further context and are eager for part 2 so apparently the movie worked for them as well.

[ethbr1]

That the new Dune movie was widely enjoyed is a testament to the central themes and plot of Dune, moreso than an opinion on Lynch vs Villeneuve.

Honestly, I want to go back and watch the Sci Fi miniseries too, which also had a sequel that goes through Messiah and Children.