[everythingctl]

Has any startup succeeded by starting out offering shiny hardware running innovative new software, all of which they have to develop?

It seems like a fatal dilution of focus to have to worry about the design and logistics of a fancy dumb terminal widget when you also have to get the software/AI/app integration stuff right.

Just make an app with text and voice interaction. Accept that the thing in our pockets with a screen and an internet connection is going to be a smartphone. You will not build an own-hardware moat with these weird little bits of e-waste.

[paxys]

I don't think there has been a single successful hardware startup in the last decade, so the answer to your question is safely "no" without even going into specifics.

Which is sad, because I'm sure there's room for a lot more innovative devices in the world outside of a single glass rectangle in your pocket that everyone must plug into in some way. The economics of the industry just makes it very hard for them to survive, and we all lose out because of it.

[sbarre]

Analogue ( https://www.analogue.co/ ) comes to mind..

Genki Things is another...

I'm sure there are others?

[Aurornis]

There are tons of successful hardware startups in recent history.

You just don't hear about them because they're not selling to you. They make business, commercial, and industrial hardware.

Consumer hardware is very hard because consumers are extremely demanding of hardware. Just look at how difficult it is to convince people to spend even $5-10 on useful software or sign up for a $100/year SaaS product with near zero marginal cost per customer. Consumers are really hard to please and consumer price points are difficult to serve.

[paxys]

In just a few years around 2007-2012 we got Oculus, Nest, Ring, Blink, Fitbit, Beats, Oura, Square, Pebble, Tile, Dropcam, SmartThings, Makerbot, Neato, Raspberry Pi... All pure consumer hardware startups with popular products and successful exits. So it's not like the category is somehow fundamentally not viable. It just needs VCs and consumers to both shift from the smartphone-only mindset and start taking some risks.

[coffeebeqn]

Oculus? I guess it’s been over a decade already

[paxys]

Founded July 2012. And while the company was successful in the sense that it got an exit its product isn't exactly doing too well.

[andybak]

I would argue it is. I've got a Quest 3 sitting next to me and I think it's great.

I can't speak for the deranged expectations, hype cycles and back-lashes over the last 5 years. And I think Meta's R+D budget is pretty hard to justify. But I don't think that reflects on their current product range (which could have been matched with a much smaller budget - and to some degree has been)

[coffeebeqn]

I’ve used their products. While the market is still small it is one of the coolest hardware projects I’ve ever experienced

[endofreach]

> The economics of the industry just makes it very hard for them to survive

Care to expand on that?

[paxys]

Hardware companies have (1) greater costs to get off the ground (2) longer periods of development (3) higher incremental cost per sale (so harder to scale) (4) slower iteration speed, and (5) just overall a lot riskier than pure software. A VC fund is going to see a startup with a groundbreaking innovate hardware device next to one building a cookie cutter SaaS app and still invest in the latter, because it just makes more business sense for them. No one outside of Apple/Google/Microsoft and the like is pouring 10 years and billions of dollars towards releasing a new device.

[ninive]

While I do agree with the topics and perceive them as changing resistance, I would like to add that bootstrapping your community is always a good idea for a successful business, so VCs are not essential. On the other end, I feel that personal data control and the human willingness to daily give away so many tasks are hard barriers on the long distance.

[wmf]

In the case of Humane and Rabbit the software doesn't sound all that innovative relative to ChatGPT/Copilot.

[jazzyjackson]

I guess the Pebble watch is the last thing that comes to mind from a new entrant. The original ipod? lol.

[ZiiS]

Despite a loved and wellmade product; Pebble lasted three years a decade ago, not sure that is "succeeded".