[yesiamyourdad]

This is the part that's left out of every statement that starts with "There's a shortage of workers in industry X" ... "willing to accept the current wages / working conditions".

Similar for "jobs Americans won't do"... "at the wages being offered".

It drives me insane that people freely accept the concept of supply and demand, except when it comes to labor.

[boplicity]

There's a second part to this argument.

There would be riots, for example, if agricultural workers were paid rates that would make Americans willing to do this. If you think food inflation is bad now, that would be off the charts.

Like it or not, we benefit from cheap labor, across many, many different industries.

[tenebrisalietum]

Cheap labor needs cheap food and cheap housing.

[boplicity]

Some of the "housing" for migrant workers would be considered quite appalling by most Americans.

[kypro]

Something I advocate for in the UK is that we should actively suppress wages of industries like healthcare and agricultural with cheap foreign labour, while providing access to good and affordable education so that native workers maximally benefit from the migrant labour underclass. Specifically I think we should bring foreign workers here on mass to work in specific industries then deport them if they're unable to find work. We should ensure they're not allowed to work in other industries to reduce labour competition with natives working in sectors for which we don't want to suppress wages.

That said, some people disagree with the ethics of importing a migrant underclass which we're knowingly underpaying, but I'd agree with you that the current system benefits us, although it could be better with more immigration and labour controls.

[iamflimflam1]

What is your plan for when that cheap labour runs out or starts to become more expensive?

How are you going to compete with other countries doing the same thing but offering a better deal?

[chii]

> some people disagree with the ethics of importing a migrant underclass

and those very same people would also "disagree" with higher prices for essential goods/services.

[kypro]

Yeah exactly.

When people cite the benefits of mass immigration, eg, "where are all the nurses going to come from it we don't import workers?". I'd argue what they're actually saying here is, "if we don't create a migrant underclass who is going to work for the crappy pay we give nurses?". The only reason we need migrant workers to fill these roles is that they don't pay attractively enough for natives to apply to them.

The main benefits of immigration on a native population is that you create a migrant underclass. So if that's what we seem to want then our current immigration system could be improved. That's really all I argue.

[gedy]

> If you think food inflation is bad now, that would be off the charts.

I don't have a stat but looking in past the manual labor costs of food is very small percentage.

[HDThoreaun]

True for staple crops, not fruits and vegetables. Many of those need to be hand picked still. Until theyre automated those farms would not be able to make any sales if they paid American level wages because everyone switch to cheaper imported produce. All the farms in the central valley and imperial valley could not exist without farm migrants.