[hammock]

Being attractive isn’t just about members of the opposite sex wanting to bone you.

It’s about having a head start in the pecking order game for any room you walk into, work or social or otherwise. It’s about people moving out of your way on the sidewalk instead of the other way around. It’s about people showing respect and going the extra mile at the airline counter or the retail store.

There are a lot of subtle benefits that people probably don’t want to readily acknowledge

[giantg2]

"It’s about people moving out of your way on the sidewalk instead of the other way around."

More likely to signify who is or isn't the asshole.

[hammock]

You can still move aside if you want to. The difference is the choice is yours.

If you were always moving out of the way when you were smaller, because you had to, is it so noble? If it isn’t truly a choice to?

Becoming attractive unlocks doors in the world that were previously locked. It’s always up to the individual what they do with them

[giantg2]

"If you were always moving out of the way when you were smaller, because you had to, is it so noble?"

There are other ways to be precieved as dangerous. Appearing to be dangerous is the real choice. Having the image of being bigger/stronger can actually have negative effects as well when considering things like what level of force is considered justified against you, other people seeking to prove dominace just due to your threatening appearance, etc.

"Becoming attractive unlocks doors in the world that were previously locked."

Not really. Sure it would help in certain things like mate selection, being an OF model, etc. Maybe you get slightly more courteous treatment. But it's not really opening doors that couldn't be opened in other ways. Not to mention that being attractive does not require big muscles. There are other ways to achieve that.

[hammock]

Agreed on the first point and good context. Tempted to lump it in with “great responsibility.” Doesn’t just apply to physical size, if you are a CCW it’s important to take extra care to avoid situations you don’t want to be in like someone else (cop or otherwise) thinking you’re a threat when you’re not

On the second point, may I ask do you have big muscles?

[giantg2]

I have some muscles, but not that big. Overall I'm physically attractive.

Muscles and attractiveness might have made my situation slight better in some ways (like dating), but it hasn't made up for social inadequacy. There are many people who are less attractive who have gone further in their careers etc with better social skills and such. So there are multiple angles to get ahead. Being physically attractive doesn't hurt, but I think being attractive in other ways is more important.

[bigtunacan]

Such a naive take. I suspect you haven't spent much time in bad neighborhoods where there's a high chance that the "weak" looking person approaching on the sidewalk is strapped. You don't show some mutual respect and you're likely to get shot.

[hammock]

I live in Chicago man. Im always on the border of a bad neighborhood, I play pickup in the park anywhere, and I regularly volunteer on the statistically worst block of the entire city. I have spent time as an inmate in Cook County Jail(1). Come visit some time I’ll show you around

(1)https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cook_County_Jail

[bigtunacan]

If that's the case then you should know being fit isn't going to mean much if you run into an actual BMFer.

I grew up in Atlanta and I lived in Chicago for awhile. From my personal experience, and the stats back me up, Atlanta is worse for violent crimes. The worst thing that happened in Chicago was someone broke into my car when I wasn't home. In Atlanta I was stabbed when I wouldn't hand over my wallet.

Through sheer luck during my youth I didn't end up dead or in prison.

[tptacek]

I live in Chicago(land --- across Austin from Austin and Augusta). What is statistically the worst block of the entire city?

[mattgreenrocks]

> If you were always moving out of the way when you were smaller, because you had to, is it so noble? If it isn’t truly a choice to?

I get what you're saying, but the subtext is the weak are less noble because they can be pushed around. Feels like punching down.

> Becoming attractive unlocks doors in the world that were previously locked.

Much better framing.

[hammock]

And I get that what I said can be interpreted that way but it’s far from the truth. If anything it’s easier for the weak to be noble because there are fewer decisions they are given to make.

At the other end of the spectrum it’s nearly impossible to be consistently noble if you are say, the leader of the free world, with great power comes great responsibility etc.

But in the Catholic Church for example there are just as many saints who had small influence, often not even extending beyond themselves to another person, as there are saints with massive, global influence

[matwood]

Not in my experience. The people who are assholes are usually not confident in who they are. They feel they always have to prove something. People who are confident in themselves if something goes down are typically the nicest people.

[giantg2]

Yeah, and the assholes are the ones who expect people to move out of their way because they're bigger.

[snapcaster]

Agreed, it's everyone that treats you better not just potential mates