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by throwaway1492 901 days ago
I never understood the "salt scarcity in antiquity" idea. As in they could just use a splash brine water from the sea if you physiologically need salt. And transport sea water inland as needed.
5 comments

It really wasn't any more scarce than let's say wheat. And price seems to have been around same level with wheat take or leave some depending on distance from production.

What really made it special was that it was commodity with possibly limited production locations, that kept extremely well and was in steady demand. So it is one thing that everyone uses and is relatively easy to tax. And the price likely was much more stable compared to food and other goods.

The large scale demand also lead to it being desirable as military target, once you control the production you are good.

Transporting water from a well is already a pain in the neck. You think they're going to transport bulk seawater deep inland just to make their food soggy?
Seawater is alive, from the sulfate reducing microbes you'll have rotten eggs flavoured brine before the trip is over
No, but it's very easy to make the seawater into salt and then transport the salt.
Define easy
You need to move seawater into an area where it won't empty back into the sea. This requires a jar.

And you need to carry the salt. That's it. Salt can't rot and it's needed everywhere; this is just about the easiest piece of commerce you can do.

Turning seawater into salt by evaporating it works in areas where evaporation is substantially higher than precipitation, so mostly in dry, warm areas. It won’t work very well in Northern Europe for example. Salt needs to be kept moderately dry when transporting it, while it can’t rot, it’s still not trivial to transport.

And salt was not only flavoring, but one of the few means of preserving food. Access to salt was not a mere culinary issue, it was a matter of survival. This means that there was substantial trade, and substantial value in salt production and trade.

Turning seawater into salt by evaporating it works in areas where evaporation is substantially higher than precipitation, so mostly in dry, warm areas.

Agree Northern Europe would be tough, but there are plentiful salt ponds in Vietnam where the humidity (plus the rain) would make one think evaporation would be challenging, but apparently it works.

Very simple. Now scale it to feed an army with 2000 year old technology.
Ok, but remember, in this benighted subthread, we're comparing with a proposal to move seawater instead, in equivalent amounts.
I can't tell what you think you're saying. Not only was this done routinely, it was much easier than the more obvious problem of providing the army with grain.
No kidding, that's why that one actually happens.
Ukrainian tradition and folklore prominently features these guys: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chumak . While the Wiki page mentions that in Ukrainian The Milky Way is called The Way of Chumaks it doesn't explain why -- but if you know the folklore, you'd immediately see that the idea is that it's the salt spillovers from their carts.

Salt was one of the most important goods that were traded over long distances. And no, technologically it wasn't advantageous to transport seawater or try to convert seawater into salt. Ukrainian city of Soledar that was prominently featured in the news last year literally means "gifting salt" -- and it has huge historical salt mines under it.

So, not only in antiquity, all the way through to the 19th century salt was one of the key goods traded over long distances. It wasn't as scarce as diamonds, but due to high demand it was still a worthwhile thing to trade.

Main purpose for salt was good preservation. That's why it was extremely valuable.
According to the article, a Roman soldier could buy about 15 (modern) pounds of salt with a single day's wages.

Comparisons are very hard, but to put that in a bit of perspective: at an average salary of $60k/yr, a typical American today makes $165/day. So the cost in time for a Roman to buy salt would be roughly equivalent to if the price for salt today were $11/lb.

That's more expensive than it is today (I just bought salt for ~$2.50/lb), but it's a far cry from extremely valuable.

$60k/yr is a poor comparison because even modern Solders get paid less than average at a base but get room and board + many benefits.

An Army private starts at, $1,833/mo that’s 21k/year. Even corporal is only getting $2,393/mo to start and cap at $2,906/mo w/ 10 years. https://www.military-ranks.org/army-pay

So a modern soldier starts at ~24lb/day of your 2.50$/lb salt, but also has much cheaper alternatives.

Like I said, comparisons are hard. The point is that it wasn't a luxury good or an exceptionally valuable commodity, it was affordable.
US military is actually paid very well.

You’re right about the wages, but single soldiers live on base (no housing costs) and are also fed (no food costs).

That’s $1,833 per month is all discretionary which is why you hear the stories of 18 year old privates buying a new <insert fast car>. A $800/month car payment is no problem with plenty left over.

And once you get married you can live off base and a Basic Housing Allowance. If stationed in San Francisco (unlikely, but a good example), you get $3,177/month as an E-2 (Private 2nd class).

You get even more money with kids.

Then add on top a full pension after 20 years and full healthcare coverage through the VA.

Overall military pay is actually quite high.

Yep. Some combination of drying, salting, and smoking was pretty much it.

No refrigeration. No freezing. No canning.

They used a lot of salt.

Don't forget about fermenting and pickling.

They also had cellars and natural refrigerators.

I think in that statement the "extremely" carries way too much weight.

As it would imply price to be very high. Which then would mean that regular people would not have access. But they also widely used salt. So it could not have been extremely valuable as we understand. Or maybe gasoline is extremely valuable commodity now...

Yes, you can compare it with today's oil trade.

Salt production and trade have been restricted, usually state-owned monopoly. Cities with salt mines like Salzburg became extremely rich, like oil countries today.

Is gasoline valuable? Yes. Is affordable? Yes, but not for everyone. Same with salt back than.

> Is affordable? Yes, but not for everyone. Same with salt back than.

That isn't possible; someone who can't afford salt dies. It's like claiming that water "isn't affordable for everyone". It is, and it must be, because people who can't afford it also can't exist.

Above comment said it was not scarce, not that it wasn't valuable.
If it is not scarce - the value is low.
Breathable air is pretty valuable, at least for me. And it's definitely not that scarce on this planet.
Well it was. Supposedly it cost about the same as wheat by volume (and salt is ~50% more dense). So it was dirt cheap.
Huh? Who’s gonna pour seawater on their food or to preserve meats?

The reality was just that making salt is an unpleasant, labor intensive task. In the Roman era, this involved slaves and thus capital.