[Mattasher]

There is no such thing as "universal health care" in a country, in any meaningful sense. Every country with government run health care rations with limits on availability, wait times, excluded treatments (mental health, dental, vision, drugs, acupuncture, etc), and often by personal clout/connections (this is the case in Canada, where I lived for many years).

Note this is in no way a defense of the US system, which is messed up six ways from Sunday.

[Broken_Hippo]

I have lived in Norway for a number of years.

And yes, there is. At least in comparison to the US system: "Universal" means everyone gets a basic level of care.

... Rations? There are no set limits, though they might not build another MRI machine if the existing ones aren't being used enough. It isn't like health insurance doesn't limit your care: They just tell you they won't cover x or y. And your denial of care will be different than what your neighbor gets in the US instead of everyone being treated nearly the same.

My drugs are covered in general. And when I purchase them, most are fairly cheap compared to the US.

Wait times definitely exist in the US as well, especially if you are waiting on a specialist, who likely isn't in your area unless you live in a big enough city. At least when I have wait times here, I get paid time off work if it is necessary.

Mental health is included.

Acupuncture isn't actual medicine.

Dental and vision aren't included here: Vision isn't generally too expensive (my partner and I both wear glasses) and dental has a discount. I think these should be included, though. Still better than dental insurance in the US - at least i can afford a dentist here. The dental is included in some systems (looking at you, Brazil).

In short, the complaints are the same in most places. Especially in the states.

[_heimdall]

> Acupuncture isn't actual medicine.

That's an extremely dismissive take on a practice that has been around for an extremely long time.

"Alternative medicines", which itself is a dismissive name, get thrown out way to quickly in the west.

[pxmpxm]

Blood letting and crystals have been around for a while as well; I don't think that's really the benchmark you wanna go with for healthcare treatment.

[_heimdall]

Modern medicine also had plenty of practices along the way that we now disagree with. Cherrypicking two examples to discredit the acupuncture is a terrible way to prove a point.

My argument wasn't that alternative medicines must be just as effective because they're old. My point was simply that hand waving anything that isn't western medicine is a very close minded view in a community that is so often pushing for equality and open mindedness above all else.

[pxmpxm]

> Wait times definitely exist in the US as well, especially if you are waiting on a specialist, who likely isn't in your area unless you live in a big enough city.

That is simply untrue, the only thing reminiscent of "wait time" is the actual scheduling of an appointment - ie call the office and they pencil you in for next Thursday or something. Or if you actually walk into an ER with something trivial.

[troupo]

"The average wait for an appointment with a physician for new patients is 26 days, according to a 2022 survey of 15 metropolitan areas by the physician recruiting firm Merritt Hawkins. That's the longest it has been since the company began doing the survey in 2004"

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wellness/2023/10/30/medical-a...

That's not too bad. Until you start counting people who never get to a doctor because their insurance doesn't cover costs.

[iteria]

Getting that first appointment for a specialist can definitely have a long wait time. It took me 1 year to get in with a specialist to see my daughter diagnosed. I was was several waitlists trying to see any doctor. Granted this is the worst it'll ever be because covid caused a backlog, but I'm told by other parents they had to wait 3 months. It took me 3 months to get that first appointment with mu specialist too.

Now after I've seen that doctor once? Now I can make almost same day appointments and I have access to staff nurses for basic questions, etc. But yeah the wait for specialists can be long. It's usually not for generalist specialists. Like I saw a neurologist within a week, but the really specialized neurologist I got recommended out to was a 3 month wait.