| > Each business is trying to innovate and do something different in order to make money This might be shocking for you but _most_ businesses do not innovate anything. That's how the world works, very few people innovate. > Also frameworks do a lot of stuff very mediocre, which is fine for quick demos or PoCs but can’t be the final version of a dev team takes pride in their work Github was written in Rails, I guess by your logic original developers should be ashamed of what they built? Would they be able to deliver something like that if they had some sticks&stones version of an http library built by one guy in the beginning? > For instance, in ASP.NET, without trying it out tell me what is the exact HTTP response if I have a route registered like GET /foo/bar and someone makes a HTTP POST /foo/bar/ ???
Will it be a 404, a method not allowed? How is the trailing slash dealt with? Does it count as a different route a to the HTTP spec or does ASP.NET trim it when routing? Will the response be in text/html, text/plain or maybe application/json? I bet 99.999% of .NET devs can’t answer this without trying it out and might actually find out that their own APIs don’t quite react to how they would like to if they could choose. So that’s a framework issue, because you have business logic running there giving your end users a response which you don’t even know about or understand. I'm sorry but this is the most ridiculous comment I've read on HN so far. Besides that all of those questions are basics that anyone who actually works with the stack will be able to answer easily, how does someone's familiarity of framework X internals define this frameworks usability? How will this differ if I jump into your hand-made solution? How long will it take to find out what happens if I give it an invalid path/method/param? I would even argue that if you write that by hand it will take much, much longer to deliver new features and actually customize than adjusting web framework's behavior that exists for over a decade.
Is it a bad thing that web frameworks have some kind of defaults that you can adjust? Hell, I WANT my web framework to return the same response if you give it a wrong http method on every endpoint, I don't want it to depend on whatever-developer-wrote-that-method-whim. > Of course, if you’re a mediocre developer who doesn’t take pride and just goes with whatever the framework does out of the box (...) then sure a framework is the right tool for you So now we define someone as mediocre, because they don't know the internals of the tool they use? Do you know internals of your oven? I guess you're a mediocre cook then. Oh so you can't make ChatGPT yourself? Sorry, you're a mediocre developer, clearly. You do realize that developer's job is to deliver solutions and solve _business_ problems, not invent the wheel, right? Knowing how to write a quicksort doesn't make you an exceptional worker and that's what you are, a worker, like any other. |
Consider, for example, that there's a famous video by Shopify (now already a couple of years old) where they explain how it took them a year to upgrade Rails. In that whole video, I didn't see anybody even ask the question whether there wasn't something fundamentally wrong if it takes you a year to upgrade one piece of your tech stack - something which has no direct impact on value delivered to customers.